Peter King Tweet: Do you think the Chiefs sign both Dwayne Bowe and Brandon Carr? ... No. Carr more likely.
Everyone's got an opinion...
3 months ago
kcsno56
102 comments
0 recs |
Email
PrintComments
ain't it the truth
Everyone’s got an opinion
Twisted Lord of AP Color Commentary (H/T - Loco)
Winner: 2009 Nostradamus of Arrowhead Pride Award
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
Yeah, just heard Nick Wright the other day saying he doesn't think we will be able to re-sign Carr
I don’t know who to believe. And I think Pioli wants it that way.
Nicknames I have coined:
Jamaal Charles = 'Haley's Comet'
Shaun Smith = 'Big Nasty'
Kelly Gregg = 'Old Gregg'
He's such an idiot.
We have the most cap room out of every team in the league. If we can’t afford to resign Carr, then nobody can.
by wustl_chiefs_fan on Feb 17, 2012 12:51 PM CST up reply actions
Wright didn't say we couldn't afford to bring Carr back. And he didn't really mean that we would literally be incapable of doing it.
He’s been saying for months that he thinks Carr is going to get a huge offer from somebody and that Pioli isn’t going to get into a bidding war to keep him. Thus, since the Chiefs won’t overpay, they may not be able to keep him here.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
probably a valid point
I don’t see Pioli getting into bidding wars
the only counter-argument I will throw out… Carr could (and hopefully will) be locked up BEFORE he sees an offer from another team.
I personally don’t think Carr is so greedy that he won’t sign a good contract offer from KC, even before he “tests the water”… and I also think Bowe gets a long term deal… and they can still tag one of them….
everyone is panicking a bit too early, IMHO… I won’t worry until March 13
I agree with this string. I don't see the Chiefs getting into a bidding war for either Bowe or Carr.
If the Chiefs wanted to sign these guys I think it would have been already done so or will be signing them before FA begins. Once they hit the market, unless the player wants to come back—I don’t see them signing back with KC.
For the fans that have been waiting 20+ years for a playoff win—well there is a reason for that—and quick frankly the players know that as well.
The front office and ownership of this team needs to be accountable.
by NFL season ticket holder on Feb 17, 2012 5:26 PM CST up reply actions
Ha!!!!!!!!!!
Providing COLOR commentary for Arrowhead Pride! AKA The Picture Diva!
"I am a femme fatale, my dear."- Carla Bruni-Sarkozy
"Meow!"- Cat Woman
I wonder why he thinks Carr is more likely
I have to feel that one of them will sign a long term deal, and I would believe the team would put the most effort towards Bowe, as he is individually more important to the offense than I believe Carr is to the defense.
If we can get Bowe signed, we can tag Carr and get a deal worked out with him ASAP.
I'm so overrated, I'm underrated.
by RememberDelaney37 on Feb 17, 2012 8:49 AM CST via mobile reply actions
RAC stayed as the coach, defensive players love him is why its more likely IMO
Bowe could easily want too much, or not want to have Cassel as the QB for another season and look for a new home
I don't start arguments, I provoke thinking. -Me
Josh Chichester TE 2012 Draftee
by BAMFSpecialOps on Feb 17, 2012 8:52 AM CST up reply actions
True
But again, with Bowe being such an important part of the offense, I would hope the team would consider paying him close to his demands.
Unfortunately, really nothing the team can do about its QB situation currently unless it wants to over-commit to Orton, which I don’t see happening.
I'm so overrated, I'm underrated.
by RememberDelaney37 on Feb 17, 2012 9:01 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
It's not like we have not given good deals to the in-house players
I could just see Bowe wanting top 3 money, after the Fitz deal(and possible upcoming Megatron deal) no way that happens.
I would love to see them both stay on the Chiefs, and if we have another FA year grabbing the smaller names.. I would still count it a good FA period
I don't start arguments, I provoke thinking. -Me
Josh Chichester TE 2012 Draftee
by BAMFSpecialOps on Feb 17, 2012 11:47 AM CST up reply actions
I think it is becasue I really believe Bowe is going to want too much money.
I think either he is franchised or he is gone.
The views expressed by craig in calgary do not necessarily represent the views of all Canadians.
Bowe's been talking to the media like he fully expects to be a Chief next year
And if you’re sticking with Cassel, you better keep Bowe.
Predictions:
I'm going to stop predicting positive things
amen, Bowe makes Cassel look better then he really is.
Predictions:
Chiefs will have a top 5 pass defense next season!!!
Tamba will lead the league in sacks.
Jamal Charles will lead the league in Rushing yards and YPC (again)
The running game last year made Cassel look good.
This year we seen what Cassel looks like.
The views expressed by craig in calgary do not necessarily represent the views of all Canadians.
It doesn't matter who the QB is
Without him, we have a major hole at #1 WR.
What hole?
We have Mims
I don't start arguments, I provoke thinking. -Me
Josh Chichester TE 2012 Draftee
by BAMFSpecialOps on Feb 17, 2012 11:45 AM CST up reply actions
Tampa Bay probably needs Carr more than Bowe.
They’ve got a good young stable of receivers. But Aquib Talib is in legal trouble and Ronde Barber is probably going to retire considering that he’s approximately 800 years old.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
Please disregard this comment as it was meant to be in reply to "chiefsman!"
In fact, I think I’ll cheat and just double post it where it should be.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
possibly Tampa Bay Bucs
They have Tons of money like us , and needs a WR . At least their Qb isnt that bad. I REALLY hope we keep both tho.
He's young and was good in 10
Every buc sucked in 11 . Lol.
by chiefsman! on Feb 17, 2012 9:52 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Or
How about that Defense? In their 12 losses they gave up an average of 35.3 points. I understand that Freeman threw a lot of INTs this season, but the defense didn’t do a lot to help. That whole team took a step back in basically every category.
Freeman’s yardage, yards per game and completion percentage all went up, and total TDs only dropped 5 (20 vs 25). Don’t forget that he played 1 fewer game in 2011 than 2010 as well (makes some numbers a bit better but his INT numbers worse).
Strangely there was a dip in his downfield numbers, completing roughly only 2/3rds of his 2010 total in 20+ yard completions, and 1/2 of his total in 40+ yard completions. It would seem that his WRs took a step back or maybe his O-line wasn’t protecting him as well (though his sack numbers are only marginally higher).
In any case, yes, Freeman certainly had a down year, but again I think the whole team took a step back, not just him. I also wouldn’t go so far as to say he “sucks”. Though he did dip is toe in Lake Suckypasser this year.
I think Freeman can rebound next year and end up a good QB. Which, if I look at someone like Mark Sanchez, though their numbers are both suspect from this year and a lot of people bag on Sanchez., I actually don’t see Sanchez ever doing much better than he’s doing now. Also he didn’t have a “regression” year like Freeman, he actually progressed this year compared to years past and still doesn’t seem to cut the mustard.
For the record, I’d also take Freeman over Cassel.
by Ochophosphate on Feb 17, 2012 10:59 AM CST up reply actions
His defense was on the field so much because he stank.
I’m not saying he can’t rebound, but don’t say he isn’t that bad. he WAS terrible.
Freeman was every bit as good as Cassel in '10
Most would say better.
Freeman:
3451 yards, 25-6 TD/INT, 61.4 comp %, 7.3 YPA, 95.9 QBRating
Cassel:
3116, 27-7, 58.2%, 6.9, 93.0
Freeman was actually pretty damn great. Also led the NFL in Comeback W’s.
What’s funny/interesting, Bucs fans don’t hate Freeman, Chiefs fans certainly hate Cassel.
If the Bucs offered a trade of Freeman for Cassel, straight up
would anyone on AP turn them down? I know I would pull the trigger in a second.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
I agree that Freeman had a great year and would trade Cassel for him as well.
Morejust having fun than anything, but did want to make the point that anyone can have a hot year once. I’m not sold on Cassel and still pretty uncertain about Freeman as well.
I don't know man.
Give me Freeman’s 2010 comeback wins, deep ball ability, age, 500 extra passing yards, > 60 completion percentage, 1 fewer interception, and slightly higher TD:INT ratio over Cassel’s 2 extra TD passes.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
a lot of those tds were 1 yard throws to catch the d off guard...
We would run it down within the 5 then cassel would throw to bowe for the td. That is why the yards are low and the tds for both cassel and bowe were relatively high.
They don't need a WR
They have Mike Williams, Arrelious Benn, and Desmond Briscoe. That is a solid group of young WR.
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
Mike Williams is good
The others are ok. I they they need a Big Reciever playmaker . Why wouldn’t they want a veteran WR . So they have two great recievers and 2 pretty good . Not like money is an issue for them. And i wouldn’t have said so Tampa but I saw something on NFL.com about it and it made me think a little bout it . I don’t think it will happen I think chiefs keep him . But it’s just one of those possibilities
by chiefsman! on Feb 17, 2012 9:55 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Tampa Bay probably actually needs Carr more than Bowe.
They’ve got a good young stable of receivers. But Aquib Talib is in legal trouble and Ronde Barber is probably going to retire considering that he’s approximately 800 years old.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
NO DOUBLE POSTING !
just kidding, i saw what you did up there ;) , yea they most certainty need carr or a corner. I was just throwing it as a possibility. i just heard it from the “experts” over at NFL.
Maybe Pioli trades Bowe to the Pats or Bengals for their 2 first round picks
3 picks in the first round would fill up majority of the holes. Maybe they believe in Baldwin enough to make him the #1.
I think we should trade Barry Richardson for a 1st, then we can draft a good RT.
The views expressed by craig in calgary do not necessarily represent the views of all Canadians.
Maneri is the next Gronk
He should fetch us a 1st and a 2nd.
We might have 30 picks by the time the draft comes around.
The views expressed by craig in calgary do not necessarily represent the views of all Canadians.
If you think Madden 03 was great for exploiting and stockpiling draft picks you should try 12.
You can trade for future picks now.
"[Jamaal Charles] probably fights crime in his spare time while inhaling carbon emissions, exhaling oxygen, and crapping oil. That’s how awesome he is. Not just good for the Chiefs, but America."
- MNchiefsfan
Why would the Bengals do that
when they have AJ Green and Jerome Simpson
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
If Bowe leaves
Then we HAVE to sign Colston or another wideout. Baldwin isnt ready to be a starter let alone the go to guy, Colston is a big physical guy like Bowe and would fill the hole left by Bowe nicely, not completely but nicely. Lets just hope that doesnt happen. The D will be better without Carr than the O without Bowe
Agree
I wouldnt be happy if we paid Colston close to what Bowe wants though
by TheScreenName on Feb 17, 2012 10:13 AM CST up reply actions
with a full offseason, baldwin will be more than ready to be a starter
but not the go-to guy, i agree.
The Chiefs have $63 million or so for cap
so sign them both up!
Stanzi: "If you don't love it, leave it! USA #1"
both should have already
been signed. long ago…
Just like novocaine. give it time; always works..
The greater the fall, the grander the ascention..
Let's say for some reason, Pioli doesn't want to bring both back...
I don’t agree with that, but let’s just put that out there as an option.
It makes it even more irresponsible not to get one locked up before FA starts. That way you can tag and trade the other.
The Chiefs motivation for getting at least one locked up before FA should be ridiculously high…you are essentially throwing away whatever the trade value is of the other if you don’t do it, and either is worth a 2nd round pick, at worst.
Yep, how this plays out will say a lot about the capabilities of the GM.
"Hater" is a term used by weak-minded people in the face of legitimate criticism.
I don't think you can really put it all on the GM
Let’s say Pioli gives Bowe and Carr a fair market value contract. It may all depend on what they both want. If they want to help continue to build this franchise into a contender, then I can see both of them staying. If they want to win championships now, they may opt to go somewhere else for less money so they can win in a year or 2. We also know that some guys are in this league just to collect a paycheck and they may flee to the highest bidder.
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
The Chiefs have no excuses not to be the highest bidder. The amounts would have to be absolutely outrageous (as in being the top paid receiver for Bowe) to use that excuse. Sometimes you have to overpay to make your team better, you can’t expect every player to re-sign at a discount. Unless the contracts would really hamstring the Chiefs they should do what it takes to sign them both and, unless they have some other big plans, being the highest bidder would do much less harm to the team than losing the player.
"Hater" is a term used by weak-minded people in the face of legitimate criticism.
But that has no affect on if he wants to win a championship now, as mentioned
And if Bowe does go somewhere else, we will likely never know the contract we offered him, and if it was more, less, or equal to the contract he received from the other team.
Point being, im not sure how him signing/not signing shows the capability of the GM
I'm so overrated, I'm underrated.
by RememberDelaney37 on Feb 17, 2012 11:20 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Not being able to sign either does, imo
We have too much on the line to not at least lock one up. Again, if you aren’t going to be able to get a deal done with one of the two, and you know this, its all the more imperative to get the other locked to slap tag on them, even if it is just to deal.
If we can’t get either signed, as I said elsewhere, you are essentially throwing away a 2nd round pick minimum.
It will say a lot about the GM. I’m still hopeful that he can get it done.
But even the most successful GM can't make a player be a part of building a winner vs. going to an established winner
A GM in his fourth season, while doing a pretty decent job improving on where this team was when he took over, hasn’t gotten us to that “established” level yet. So if a player has the option to go to an established winner, what more can we do to stop him?
It seems every time I ever even suggested that Bowe or Carr were going to want more money than they were worth, I was lambasted for suggesting that they would be “money hungry”. Now, when it comes down to it, everyone seems to believe that throwing the most money at them should be enough to sway them.
Interesting
I'm so overrated, I'm underrated.
by RememberDelaney37 on Feb 17, 2012 11:35 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
The most successful GM should be able to convince his player that this team is going to be a winner
Immediately.
And are you of the opinion that Bowe and Carr are going to both sign with teams that are much closer to being winners?
I keep saying this, and it doesn’t seem to stick with anyone…it doesn’t matter if Bowe or Carr want more $ than they are worth, they are only going to get what they are offered, not what they want. I refuse to accept that we are $63 mil under the cap, have a major need for both of these players, and cannot match the offer of what (at least one) of these guys will see on the open market. Again, screw what they want, it’s not about that, it’s about what they will actually get.
I will never call a player ‘money hungry’ and I don’t blame either of them for wanting to A. be on a winner and/or B. want as much money as possible. I will blame Pioli if he can’t sign at least one of them to a deal before FA starts. The team simply has too much to lose by not doing so.
I also think that 9 out of 10 times it is about the money. That doesn’t make a player money hungry, that makes them human. Fans don’t like to admit it, but they would do the same thing if in their position. So fans can call them whatever they want, but in the end, this is on the Chiefs to simply be financially competitive.
The most successful GM isn't trying to sell Cassell as a starting QB
Everyone knows we are not winning the SB with Cassell.
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
That's all well and good
But if one of these guys signs with the Redskins, they aren’t going to win, they are going to get paid.
If they sign with NE and Pit, then fine, they wanted to win.
***Note
There is nothing wrong with wanting to get paid. I have never said otherwise. There is something wrong with the Chiefs not wanting to pay.
But we will never know what they did or didn't want to pay
What didn’t seeme to be sticking with people is that, outside of the franchise tag, this is the player’s choice and the player’s choice only. There could be any number of reasons for either one of them to not want to come back here. PR moves of saying the right thing to the media aside, we just don’t know why players may or may not want to leave a team. Well documented public feuds between players and management aren’t the only reason for then to part ways
I'm so overrated, I'm underrated.
by RememberDelaney37 on Feb 17, 2012 12:26 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
yes...
You can think a player is lying when he says he wants to come back or has always wanted to come back. Certainly.
Personally, I think a player would be more likely to keep his mouth shut in the situation then go on with local media and say he wants to stay. Is it possible they are lying? Sure, I’ll grant you that.
Players typically want to leave a team b/c another team is offering more money. I’m going to assume that is the case until I hear/read quotes saying otherwise. We shouldn’t be outspent, certainly on both players.
*what doesn't seem to be sticking
I'm so overrated, I'm underrated.
by RememberDelaney37 on Feb 17, 2012 12:27 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
We should be able to be the highest bidder on at least one of them
Or at least match the highest bidder on one of them.
We have cap resources basically unmatched, and both players are crucial pieces to this teams success.
And the definition of
a fair market value contract
Is what someone else is willing to pay.
I consider fair market
about what Andre Johnson makes
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
No disrespect
But what you consider fair market value means nothing.
‘Market’ value is what someone else will pay, unless you own a team and are going to offer him AJ money, your opinion (or mine) means nada.
FTR, I don’t think he comes close to getting AJ money…but maybe I’ll be wrong.
Since Bowe has come into the league (2007) his stats are close to AJ
AJ DB
Catches 395 356
Yards 5403 4927
TD 35 36
I think Bowe could get something in the ballpark of what Johnson is making
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
Johnson has the current NFL record for receiving ypg.
And for starters, AJ’s yards are 5703 in the time you speak of.
And he has better stats than Bowe even missing 16 games in the time Bowe has come into the league.
Yes, I agree injuries are a factor in evaluating both players, and that factor would help Bowe out, I still don’t see him getting a deal approaching AJ’s.
Remember AJ’s last extension came before ‘10 when he was coming off of consecutive seasons of over 1550 yards. Bowe doesn’t have near the ammo AJ had at that time.
All we have to do is sign one of them
the other gets the franchise tag. No big deal.
by Chief Willie Wildcat on Feb 17, 2012 9:45 AM CST reply actions
Question: Can we transition tag one player and franchise tag the other, assuming we can't get them both signed?
Do we go fetal and beg for mercy? Or do we pick up that broken piece of pipe laying on the ground and come up swinging? I choose pipe.
Sober (again) since January 10th, 2011.
I don't think these other two posters are correct
I believe you can Franchise one and Transition Tag the other (unless this has changed under the new CBA). Transition Tag just means that you have the right to match the offer the player is getting from another team, if you don’t match it you don’t get any compensation. If you DO match it, then you can’t use the transition tag again until the player’s contract expires.
Predictions:
I'm going to stop predicting positive things
I think Bowe will certainly be here. He wants to be here and there's no reason the team wouldn't want him back
As for Carr it all depends on how much $ he expects. If he’s looking for $9m per year and they can sign Routt for $6m per, it’s just smarter to sign Routt & use the money saved to go hard after another guy like Soliai or Nicks.
Predictions:
I'm going to stop predicting positive things
Screw you Peter King and the fanny pack you rode in on
#82 - Pay The Man & Play The Man
by KansasCityShuffle on Feb 17, 2012 10:57 AM CST reply actions
|||===+++!!!THIS UPDATE JUST IN!!!+++===|||
The Chiefs either WILL or WILL NOT re-sign either or both Dwayne Bowe and/or Brandon Carr
Twisted Lord of AP Color Commentary (H/T - Loco)
Winner: 2009 Nostradamus of Arrowhead Pride Award
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
Got Gnus?
Providing COLOR commentary for Arrowhead Pride! AKA The Picture Diva!
"I am a femme fatale, my dear."- Carla Bruni-Sarkozy
"Meow!"- Cat Woman
nah, just wild and rampant speculation
Twisted Lord of AP Color Commentary (H/T - Loco)
Winner: 2009 Nostradamus of Arrowhead Pride Award
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
Gnus can be wild
Providing COLOR commentary for Arrowhead Pride! AKA The Picture Diva!
"I am a femme fatale, my dear."- Carla Bruni-Sarkozy
"Meow!"- Cat Woman
Why is Carr more likely?
From my understanding, using the franchise tag on somebody means you have to pay them top 5 money at their position. Bowe is worth that money, but Carr is not. So even if we can’t reach a deal with Bowe, we can franchise him, but if we can’t reach a deal with Carr, we probably wouldn’t franchise him.
by wustl_chiefs_fan on Feb 17, 2012 12:55 PM CST reply actions
if a deal cant be worked out with one of them, then someone will be walking for nothing....
baldwin was a 1st rd pick last year and is expected to be a 1 wr, breaston just inked long term, perrsonally, i dont think this is a 3 wr set team, i think they will copy the double TE threat attack. therefore bowe has to go, and carr, has to stay.
Pay Brandon Carr/ Pay Colquitt
Team Colquitt
It will be Maneri
Haven’t you heard, he is Gronk 2.0
Men succeed when they realize that their failures are the preparation for their victories.
Hammerfisting my own balls since 2006
Carr will not get more than Flowers
in KC and someone will well overpay. They draft a CB in the second. Bowe gets franchised.
by FrankPitts on Feb 17, 2012 10:39 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Detroit Lions DT Nick Fairley arrested again; now has more NFL arrests than NFL sacks
- Former high-school star Brian Banks does serious time on trumped-up charge, now hopes for an NFL shot
- Former ‘idiot kicker’ Mike Vanderjagt in trouble after accosting junior-high heckler
- Adrian Peterson blows teammates away in footraces; appears to be on the mend
- UPDATE: Charlie Sheen didn’t buy Lawrence Taylor’s Super Bowl ring
