My Question To Diva Fans

by shotty on Apr 23, 2011 12:13 PM CDT

Breaking News this morning on ESPN: Brandon Marshall, Wide Receiver of the Miami Dolphins, is currently in Intensive Care after being stabbed by his 26 year old wife, Michi Nogami-Marshall, who was arrested Friday for aggravated battery with a deadly weapon.

We are seeing these things happen more and more in the NFL as Diva's with incredible talent choose to believe their status has made them invincible. They have the talent to get the money, the money to back up the attitude, and the attitude to cause serious rife, both on and off the field.

In 2006, Marshall, joined by teammates Javon Walker and Darrent Williams, attended a New Years' Eve party hosted by Denver Nuggets star Kenyon Martin at a nightclub called the "The Shelter". An argument between several people escalated, and the result left Williams dead with a gunshot wound to the neck. One of the instigators was Brandon Marshall.

In 2009 Marshall was suspended for the entire pre-season by the team for walking instead of running during practice drills, batting away passes, and punting the football in protest, demanding he be traded.

You cannot tell me that these events don't impact a locker room, players, coaches, or communities. The selfish attitudes that these players have, are not only detrimental to a team, but can instigate effects that devastate families for the rest of their lives.

Many on this site believe a team doesn't have to be all saints, you can have dirty, selfish, not-so-clean around the collar guys, who, as long as they have the talent, are welcome additions. And history have shown that teams don't have to be straight-laced to win. Pittsburgh has done quite a bit with several questionable characters. So have the Jets.

For a guy like Brandon Marshall though, trouble seems to follow him everywhere, both on and off the field. The same can be said of guys like Terrell Owens, Adam Jones, and our ex, Larry Johnson.

So it better to draft a player with character concerns, believing your team can make a difference for them, say for someone like Jonathon Baldwin, who is said to be comparable to Brandon Marshall, both in talent as a receiver and in attitude? Or is it best to take a player through Free Agency, one that you already know what you'll be getting, like with Marshall?

*NOTE: Marshall is making 47 Million over the next 4 years, with 24 million guaranteed. Do you think he's worth it?

Thats my question to you.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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There's a difference between a true "diva" and having a checkered past. But the problem is, when drafting, you don't know whether one will become the other.

I have no problem drafting players who’ve made a few mistakes—if they can demonstrate that they’re mistakes, and in the past, and not part of a broader trend of poor decision-making. That’s where the Brandon Marshalls of the world get into trouble.

As much as the Ochocincos or the Owenses of the world get bashed for the character, focus, and desire to be part of a team…there’s a difference between a player with attitude who knows when to curb it, and a player with attitude who can’t control himself. Much of this starts with the coaching, in my opinion.

If you allow someone to dominate the lockerroom, instead of the GAME dominating the lockerroom, that’s when you’re in trouble. It’s no different than running a classroom as a teacher, or running an office as a manager: There will always be people with strong personalities and poor decision making abilities in your room. How will you establish the expectations, but let them take ownership of the results AND give them a place do “do their thing?”.

Some folks cannot be coached…some folks can. And some folks can’t be coached but will succeed with a little structure. Parcells got LT to buy in, and he became a legend. But neither Seifert, nor Mariucci, nor Reid, nor Parcells, nor Jauron, nor Lewis got TO to focus his talent on the game CONSISTENTLY, and not focus on his personal agenda(s).

Gotta do your homework; I guess that’s what I’m saying.

"You've only got 10 fingers to stick in the dike. Is there a breaking point that pushes you over the edge?...Where's the limit?"

-Marty Schottenheimer

by go_saleaumua on Apr 23, 2011 1:08 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs

Agreed

Don’t overgeneralize. I don’t think Jon Baldwin is a diva, maybe just a little immature.

Greg Little = yes.

2011 Mock Draft 4/17/11:
1. Phil Taylor - NT - Baylor
2. Jon Baldwin - WR - Pitt
3. James Brewer - OT - Indiana
4. Cliff Matthews - OLB/DE - South Carolina
5a. Jake Kirkpatrick - C - TCU
5b. Kelvin Sheppard - ILB - LSU
6. Chris Hairston - OT - Clemson
7. T.J. Yates - QB - North Carolina

by Nick Britt on Apr 23, 2011 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions

I'd agree. Same with Phil Taylor...

and there’s a lot of folks on AP who would blow right past both of those players. I wouldn’t mind either of them in a KC uniform.

I have to admit, though: Pioli, Rod Graves, Ted Thompson etc can do all the background checking they want and you STILL don’t know who the professionals are really going to be until they put on the pads and cash that check.

"You've only got 10 fingers to stick in the dike. Is there a breaking point that pushes you over the edge?...Where's the limit?"

-Marty Schottenheimer

by go_saleaumua on Apr 23, 2011 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions

Not true. What you do is ask the janitor.

would of ≠ would've

by hmills110 on Apr 23, 2011 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions

They’re the “eyes and ears of the institution!”

"You've only got 10 fingers to stick in the dike. Is there a breaking point that pushes you over the edge?...Where's the limit?"

-Marty Schottenheimer

by go_saleaumua on Apr 23, 2011 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions

What makes you think Little is?

He hasn’t done anything that’s diva-like. Baldwin absolutely has, like when he publicly trashed his coach.

When the world slips you a jeffrey, stroke the furry wall.

by burntorangehorn on Apr 23, 2011 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions

Please post one link where anyone is saying or proving Little to be a Diva.

If a player learns from his mistake and says he’s sorry I’m willing to give him a second chance, unless he killed someone or something like that. Little and Baldwin have both had problems and i think they both have learned from them, but i would choose Little over Baldwin because of Little’s run after the catch abilities.

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by CPT.Caveman on Apr 23, 2011 5:44 PM CDT up reply actions

excellent post and agreed ...

I will say in “defense” of Owens (what?!? ups is defending Terrell Owens???) that he’s neveer been convicted or accused of any major “criminal” thing (to my knowledge) … he is a “Diva” in the truest sense of the word, just as Randy Moss, Albert Haynesworth, Larry Johnson, Brandon Marshall (and to think some people here actually WANTED the guy a couple of yrs ago … how scary is that!) and many others …

one bad apple and all that … no thank you, I prefer peeople who get attention the old fashioned way … they EARN it (do I sound like John Houseman yet?)

Winner: 2009 Nostradamus of Arrowhead Pride Award
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!

by upamtn on Apr 23, 2011 1:28 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs

I think Brandon Marshall had been accused of some criminal wrongdoing in the past

Lots of run-ins over domestic disputes and/or violence, arrested in college, arrested for DUI (pled down), battery…the list continues. He’s obviously in a very abusive relationship with his wife, who obviously just stabbed him.

When the world slips you a jeffrey, stroke the furry wall.

by burntorangehorn on Apr 23, 2011 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions

and probably with good reason

who obviously just stabbed him

yah, I do not like Marshall at all, never have or will … same with Owens, LJ, etc

by upamtn on Apr 23, 2011 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

let's wait and see what the circumstances are before we suggest someone in critical condition was

probably (stabbed) with good reason

not many good reasons to try to kill somebody, despite what raider fans think.

(this, in no way, is an endorsement of Brandon Marshall. I do not care for him. Talent-wise, I’m glad he’s off the Broncos. Headache, disruption-wise, I wish he was still a Bronco…..maybe a charger).

Scott Pioli for President in 2012. Experience? If the current President doesn't need it, why does Pioli? Besides, Pioli has the blue collar work ethic with a white collar brain. He has humility. He is tough on security. He supports war on Sundays. And he makes sound, fiscally conservative decisions.

by chief Stevie_k on Apr 23, 2011 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions

okay, somehow read 'critical condition' from intensive care. somewhat different, but still

by chief Stevie_k on Apr 23, 2011 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions

There aren't many (if any) good reasons to stab somebody.

But if there is one, it’s probably repeated spousal abuse.

by MtHammer on Apr 23, 2011 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions

Unless you won't let go of my EGGO.

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by CPT.Caveman on Apr 23, 2011 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Quite the assumption don't you think?

Maybe saying “perhaps” rather than “probably” would be a little more appropriate.

I love my wife, my kids, and the Chiefs. In that order. Except on game days.

by MNchiefsfan on Apr 23, 2011 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

remind me not to square off with you in a court of law ...

me: “isn’t it true, Mr Marshall, that your significant other had probable cause to stab you multiple times?”

you: “objection! counsel is drawing an inference and attempting to lead the witness”

judge: “sustained”

me: “isn’t it true, Mr Marshall, that your significant other perhaps had cause to stab you multiple times?”

by upamtn on Apr 23, 2011 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

lmao

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by CPT.Caveman on Apr 23, 2011 7:09 PM CDT up reply actions

Ha!

I love my wife, my kids, and the Chiefs. In that order. Except on game days.

by MNchiefsfan on Apr 23, 2011 8:10 PM CDT up reply actions

I can't agree with that last statement more

2011 hopefuls: A new CBA, followed by a good draft, accented by a great season. In that order.

by shotty on Apr 23, 2011 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions

So with this type of attitude

would you draft a guy with strong similarities, like Jon Baldwin? We have a following on AP that think Baldwin is the best thing KC can do for itself. He has immense talent, athleticism, speed, and height. He can jump over buildings and catch bullets with his teeth. His ceiling has no limit. Except for his attitude.

He was arrested for assault, summary harassment, and summary disorderly conduct stemming from an altercation with a female student on a bus while attending Pitt. Then threw a fit about his team and publicly blasted his coach, QB, and team. Troubled and a Diva are the terms I’d like to use to describe this prospect.

2011 hopefuls: A new CBA, followed by a good draft, accented by a great season. In that order.

by shotty on Apr 23, 2011 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs

We don't need any stinken WR's with talent

The Chiefs have shown that for Years on Years already

by Steve_Chiefs on Apr 23, 2011 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Rec'd

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by CPT.Caveman on Apr 23, 2011 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions

I am not as up on the legal issues

But if those facts are true, then I would be inclined to avoid taking a chance on Baldwin until much, much later in the draft than he would otherwise go.

When the world slips you a jeffrey, stroke the furry wall.

by burntorangehorn on Apr 24, 2011 6:53 PM CDT up reply actions

hell

and to think some people here actually WANTED the guy a couple of yrs ago

i still do! the guy is an athlete, a great one. one of the best top-flight wr’s in the NFL. very talented and tall ( i have a thing for tall wr’s like marshall, johnson from detroit, johnson from houston etc.. )

he may have some off-field problems/issues but I’d still love to see him in KC because you can’t deny his ability and talent.

Winner of the 2010 Arrowhead Pride, "Beat The Insiders"

by KC Nate on Apr 24, 2011 12:07 AM CDT up reply actions

may? he MAY have??? we better dig a little deeper here, Nate ... gotta be SURE of these things, you know!

he may have some off-field problems/issues …

I mean, I’d hate to see Pioli bring the guy on board and then find out LATER that he had some problems or issues

yeah, Brandon Marshall would be a fine, upstanding member of the community and a role model for all youngsters to look up to and emulate

by upamtn on Apr 24, 2011 12:48 AM CDT up reply actions

The sarcasm font strikes again. Just one of the reasons I don't like using it.

You have to be really careful or else it will cut off your text just when it's getting to the good part.

by MtHammer on Apr 24, 2011 3:26 AM CDT up reply actions

I know, figure it shows enough that people get the main idea ;-)

by upamtn on Apr 24, 2011 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

I'm all about second and even third chances

But after enough instances it’s pretty fair to assume a guy isn’t going to change. I like the effort Marshall puts forth on the field, but the constant risk of suspension as well as the negative influence on young guys would be too much for me.

I love my wife, my kids, and the Chiefs. In that order. Except on game days.

by MNchiefsfan on Apr 23, 2011 2:23 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs

And to me, that suggests a problem with a player who was allowed to become a distraction.

Big part of why I love Pioli’s investigation into players’ backgrounds—have they been pampered? Is the attitude just an attitude, or is worse than that? Can they be coached?

Marshall consistently appears to be a problem child, and it’s not just a demeanor. He lied to the law and coaches in Denver. Now, according to PFT and several Miami newspapers, he may have lied to the law in Florida—and this time, it’s not just a problem that hurts him (an injury), but it’s a domestic violence issue.

Looks like the Parcells guys in Miami, maybe even Tuna himself, errored on this one. Like you said MN, in THIS case it seems like he’s had one chance too many.

"You've only got 10 fingers to stick in the dike. Is there a breaking point that pushes you over the edge?...Where's the limit?"

-Marty Schottenheimer

by go_saleaumua on Apr 23, 2011 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions

Perhaps this is why Pioli favors players who grew up in a home with both parents

taking an active role in their kids development? I also believe that looking into how good of a team mate and team player the Diva is has some bearing on the matter. It is one thing trying to garnish media attention deliberately to score name recognition on an agents suggestion to garner commercial success versus being a bad team member. The electronic media age has given its own set of dilemmas to these young men who have a much different mindset than some of us older folks.

by dubld on Apr 23, 2011 3:42 PM CDT reply actions

IMO....just get rid of all WRs and just run the dam ball ; )

#1 OT Gabe Carimi (Wisconsin) #4 FB Owen Marecic (Stanford)
#2 NT Jerrel "POWE" (Ole' Miss) #5 WR Greg Salas (Hawaii)
#3 G/C John Moffitt (Wisconsin) #5 ILB Mario Harvey (Marshall)
#7 C Alex Linnenkohl (Oregon State)

by Masons on Apr 23, 2011 4:18 PM CDT reply actions

HERMBALL!

*DAMMIT PANTERA THIS BEER IS WARM! GET ME ANOTHER ONE!
*When we blitz, have the LB's do a KC Strip. Do this in remembrance of DT.

by mistamic on Apr 23, 2011 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions

+1

by Steve_Chiefs on Apr 23, 2011 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions

i like that idea

chiefs superbowl champs!

Winner of the 2010 Arrowhead Pride, "Beat The Insiders"

by KC Nate on Apr 24, 2011 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions

My thing is this

If a guy has an altercation with a woman involving him putting his hands on her, that stuff never changes. It’s a sign of greater issues going on inside of a man. That is an unforgivable red flag in my eyes. Other guys can have issues and be distractions in the locker room but most of that stuff can be minimized.

by RamX21 on Apr 23, 2011 6:09 PM CDT reply actions