Offseason Brodie Croyle Returns
by Joel Thorman on Jun 14, 2010 12:08 PM CDT
in 2010 Kansas City Chiefs Season
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PrintLast year, the Chiefs had given up a second round pick for Matt Cassel and handed him a $63 million contract essentially guaranteeing he'd be the starter.
Even with that, the early word during training camp last year was that Brodie Croyle was outplaying the Chiefs new quarterback. Could it really happen? Could Croyle overtake Cassel?
The answer was no. Cassel won the job that remains his to this day.
The questions popped up last year because "Offseason Brodie Croyle" is very sharp. He's got a very good arm and when not facing a real pass rush, might be the best quarterback on the roster. There was evidence of this over the weekend, according to Adam Teicher of the Kansas City Star, who called Croyle's passing the highlight of practice.
But during a 7-on-7 passing drill when the Chiefs use no linemen on either side of the ball, Croyle was sharp. On a set of plays from inside the 20, Croyle made three straight crisp throws that resulted in touchdowns, one going to Dwayne Bowe, another to Tim Castille and the last to rookie Jeremy Horne.
Indeed in passing drills Croyle was throwing it crisply and accurately. He looked good.
Unfortunately, he hasn't demonstrated an ability to stay healthy for an extended period of time so no matter how good the offseason version of Croyle looks, the starting job isn't for him.
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Still a good sign.
When he had to step in last year he did a very good job I thought. Having a good backup is a very important aspect of a winning team. I like it, although he wont ever take over for Cassel.
Let the best man play
Contracts be damned.
D.J. #56 - Pay The Man & Play The Man
by KansasCityShuffle on Jun 14, 2010 12:19 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
+1
Kansas City Chiefs will be the dark horse to make the playoffs in 2010
by 58 was my friend on Jun 14, 2010 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
There are so m any factors playing into cassel staying the starter
that I think it’s fair to say it’s not solely based on ability,. Who the starter would be if it where based on ability alone is open for debate as far as I’m concerned, and, fortunately or not, is most definitely NOT necessarily cassel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNm2rFzdvW8&feature=related
+1
Somebody please find my college teams a home :(
by Chieffan_Toby on Jun 14, 2010 4:21 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
amen, Shuffle
and if that just so happens to be Croyle, then so be it …
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
by upamtn on Jun 14, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
If you believe Brodie is the best man then he should play.
But it won’t last long, because he will be hurt by halftime.
Don't blame me, I voted for content of character.
halftime huh?
Wow. You are giving Croyle a lot of credit there.
Rock Chalk Jayhawk!
Go Chiefs!
by ARROWHEADSHANE on Jun 14, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Still good for the team
If Croyle is the better QB when there is no pass rush, it will help our D develop in practice. I’m fine with keeping him on the roster as long as he’s helping the team improve.
Agreed
And I think he’s not a bad backup as a spot starter. Just think past history has demonstrated you can’t count on him long-term.
by Joel Thorman on Jun 14, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
plus, that may fit to his strength...he may be a clipboard guy that helps the starter...nothing wrong with that while making over 1 mil a year...
Doug Peterson and others have done it
I've stated that numerous times on WPI
A back-up QB is very important to a team and starting QB.
I rather go with the one who's more confident, competitive, mentally strong, and a better leader.
Throwing the ball hard and far is great, but it’s only one aspect that you’d want in a QB.
Other Arenas wish they could be like Arrowhead Stadium as it prepares to turn a new Page on Chiefs legacy. Rivals think they are going to be fine on an island of Flowers, but when they get hit by what feels like a Carr, they'll never be able to eat a Berry ever again.
Oh, you've been in the huddle with Brodie?
Croyle has always been said to be all of those things, and he plays injured as much as he can. He’s just too fragile to take the NFL hits. If it wasn’t for that I would definitely consider him the best QB on the roster.
by bamachief5558 on Jun 14, 2010 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions
I just want
the player that gives us the best chance to win.
Skill-wise that is probably Brodie but physically he has proven that he can’t stay healthy and there is no way that he could make it through a full season. Although, you would figure that after a few years in the league he would try to add on some extra muscle to help.
Insert witty yet thought provoking phrase here.
Sounds like something a bama fan would say,lol. jk
I think Brodie really stepped in last year for the opener. But I still think Cassel is a better gamer and show’s a little more fire than Brodie. I’m sure if the coaching staff felt that Brodie was the better man for the job they wouldnt hesitate to put him in that #1 spot.
"Without me, it's just aweso".- comment made by Jamaal Charles and Eric Berry.
by chiefs_fan05 on Jun 14, 2010 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
only thing I disagree with is ...
I’m sure if the coaching staff felt that Brodie was the better man for the job they wouldnt hesitate to put him in that #1 spot
wanna bet? I think Cassel it the Sacred QB Cow here, given his contract … and given that he was specifically brought in from (wow, gasp, who’da thunk it!) New England, former home of (wow, gasp, who’da thunk it!) Scott Pioli … yeah, I’d wager there’d be a LOT of hesitation
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
I agree if its a close competition Cassel is the #1. Might not be fair but like you stated above its a no brainer Cassel has a leg up on Croyle in that sense. But some of the comments being made is leading me to believe people think that B.Croyle is clearly better than Cassel. If that was the case they wouldn’t hesitate to replace Cassel with Croyle. I believe B.Croyle has and will be able to earn that #1 spot as long as he is a Chief.
"Without me, it's just aweso".- comment made by Jamaal Charles and Eric Berry.
by chiefs_fan05 on Jun 14, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah Haley you know the HC who makes the depth chart he is totally biased towards the contract QB.
That’s why he wanted Kurt Warner starting since he got there even though Leinart was the contract QB just saying.
You can draft defensive line to stop a player at the line.
You can draft linebackers to stop a player 3-4 yards down the field.
Or you can draft a safety to tackle him 15 yards down the field.
I'll take the first two any day.
by ChiefsfanJon on Jun 14, 2010 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions
I wasn't really egging on Brodie.
Even if both have all those qualities, Cassel is still more proven with one season going 11-5 in New England. Sure there’s plenty of factors and ways to discredit him that year, but the main difference is Cassel was able to prove SOMETHING before. It’s on paper and in the records. Hence the “nice” contract and the starting job over Croyle. Brodie unfortunately has setbacks that disable him from showing that he is a winner.
I love Caasel being the Chiefs starter. But if Brodie can do something to prove that he belongs out there, then awesome. I just want to the team to be well off and winning.
Other Arenas wish they could be like Arrowhead Stadium as it prepares to turn a new Page on Chiefs legacy. Rivals think they are going to be fine on an island of Flowers, but when they get hit by what feels like a Carr, they'll never be able to eat a Berry ever again.
I agree with you on that Bama Chief.
I don’t think it’s fair to say Croyle lacks any of those things. Everything I’ve ever heard from other players as well as the Coaches is that Brodie is a smart, confident player and most definitely a team leader kind of guy. The other players like him and so does Coach Haley. I’m very happy that we have a talented young QB as our backup.
If Cassel goes down for any period of time, I could see a QB controversy happening in KC. I for one think Brodie could really flourish in the new look Chiefs offense.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Jun 14, 2010 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions
No one, Cassel included, would have survived behind brodie's oline's those few years
barring, of course, someone like thigpen spending the entire season running for his life
Basically, the “injury” card is misused on croyle imo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNm2rFzdvW8&feature=related
bah
his injury problem dates back to high school. per wiki.
However, Croyle’s high school career ended abruptly in the first game of his senior season against Glencoe High School after a hit by an opposing player tore Croyle’s anterior crucial ligament, causing him to miss the remainder of his final year
he was hurt in college in 2004
Croyle tore his anterior cruciate ligament in his other knee.910 Croyle was forced to sit out the rest of the season, and the team finished with a 6-6 record.10
Croyle’s reputation for being injury prone caused him to drop into the third round of the draft.
Factor that in with the fact he has been hurt it would seem every time he touches the ball in the NFL….and yeah I wouldn say the “injury” card is missused at all. Brokie Croyle fits pretty damn well if you ask me.
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Jun 14, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
cassel took serious hits last year early on...few seem to remember that...he proved he was tough and could take hits. also proved he could run week 1 when we need him to
we just stopped having him run around for his own sake
I've heard that this has always been
Brodie’s modus operandi as a quarterback. In passing drills, he looks like an all-time great, because he has a big arm and is also very accurate when playing against air.
Until force fields become allowable in the NFL, though, its doubtful he will ever stay on the field long enough for it to translate.
by alakan81 on Jun 14, 2010 12:41 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
i'm a pretty goood observer and here is my opinion of croyle after watching him on hard knocks and reading articles about him:
i think he is a good player, but i think he is one of those players who plays good in practice but doesn’t translate it on the field. I guess you can say he chokes. and again this is just my opinion but i dont think croyle is a vewry good leader. hopefully he can translate it on the field in case we ever need him
"WIth the 5th pick in the 2010 NFL draft the Kansas City Chiefs select... Eric Berry Safety Tennesee... "
Maybe not choking but nothing special either
I saw Cassel still play when he couldn’t even put weight on one of his legs. Croyle wouldn’t do that he isn’t that tough. I remember many times last year Cassel put us in a position to win the game by getting up and down the field when it counted. If we were in the last 2 min of the game I would have a lot more faith Cassel would lead us down the field then I would Croyle from what I’ve seen.
by groundedchevy on Jun 14, 2010 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
True
I don’t remember Croyle playing particularly well when he was given the starting job a few seasons ago. A lot of people seem to love him because he throws a nice spiral and he didn’t have a terrible game against Baltimore in week 1 last year. That’s fine, but it doesn’t make him a better option than Cassel.
Kind of unfair because he was only a 2nd year player with a subpar team around him, but with his injury history he better be able to light it up when he’s on the field if he wants to be the starter. The fact that he throws a better ball than Cassel doesn’t make up for the deficiencies in health and experience.
Predictions:
This year will be better
Cassel and his int.'s COST us several games
More than I can say about brodie, who put up THE HIGHEST QB RATING IN YEARS the one game he started this year against the ravens. Why did he start again? Oh yeah, cassel was hurt. You can tell yourself what you need to so you can sleep at night, but truth be told, Cassel and his contract was a MISTAKE that may very well end up setting this team back a couple of years.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNm2rFzdvW8&feature=related
Same thing could be said of Croyle
Especially if they didn’t bring in another option. If Croyle was our only choice at QB I think most of use would be very worried. I don’t think Todd is the type of coach to let the best man sit on the bench. He has proved this by benching Bowe and DJ, but everyone gives him a hard time about that.
by groundedchevy on Jun 14, 2010 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions
whatever
if you do the reading available on this site, you’ll see that Cassel’s contract is not out of line nor is it harmful to the Chiefs.
New body. Same soul.
It could be...
If we release him after next season…paying him 30 million bucks and giving up a second round pick for a guy who, if we release him, will have been a shite QB could be considered harmfull to the Chiefs.
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Jun 14, 2010 8:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess
but I don’t think that’s going to happen.
Also, many people on here are crying that we aren’t spending any money and are at the bottom of the league in salary structure, so not sure even that would hurt too much.
New body. Same soul.
That's true...
But since we spend so little money…we can’t be wasting 15 million per on shit players
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Jun 14, 2010 9:55 PM CDT up reply actions
true
but I think you’ll see that he’s not a shit player this year – if you’ll let yourself.
New body. Same soul.
I gotta believe he'll be improved over last year.
Better coaches, better team, etc. etc. etc….and yeah, I don’t believe he’ll be cut after the season…but if he is…that would only mean that he had another bad year, and was a bad investment.
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Jun 14, 2010 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
That'll never happen. Cassel will do just fine this year.
I do think Croyle is a good QB though. I think the fact that this discussion is even happening is a good thing and we should all be very happy to know that we have a capable backup who can fill in if necessary.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Jun 14, 2010 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions
I think if Croyle can stay health even as a backup for a couple years
He could develop into a decent QB. He has some skills, but even when he was healthy he didn’t really look that good. I’m pretty sure he’s never won a ballgame. At the same time, he was really really young, and played on some of the worst Chiefs teams….ever. On top of that he couldn’t stay healthy, which is a problem he’s had on every level of football….except maybe Pee Wee, but hell whoes to say he didn’t get hurt then even.
He hasn’t had the best of luck, I’ll give him that. I had both of my knees blown out in high school playing baseball, both by freak accidents. I’d like to this that doesn’t make me a “pussy” so I don’t really question his toughness. Shit happens when you play sports, only the very very very lucky avoid injuries. But the fact remains…he’s never been able to stay healthy.
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Jun 14, 2010 10:24 PM CDT up reply actions
why are you so quick to defend croyle and put cassel down?
cassel is our number one QB. whether if you like it or not
"WIth the 5th pick in the 2010 NFL draft the Kansas City Chiefs select... Eric Berry Safety Tennesee... "
because he's more talented and has more upside
Imo, thigpen had/has more upside than cassel even. Hell, he’s practically a taller clone of thigpen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNm2rFzdvW8&feature=related
What's not written here is that ...
… immediately following the play, Croyle tripped and fell, knocking a filling loose and had to be rushed in for emergent dental treatment.
While there, the laughing gas administered caused him to pull three intercostal muscles and develop a hairline fracture on a rib.
He’s expected to be out 3-4 weeks.
you forgot the sarcasm font
time to give up the ghost on Croyle and injuries, people … yeah, he’s had some i the past, with weak lines and guys like 2.7 notblocking for him, but those days are past … the dude can throw, he knows defenses, he has “touch” on the ball and he knows when to “throw it away” instead of racking up sacks and/or INTs
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
what about his high school and college injuries?
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Jun 14, 2010 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
The only full seasons he's played in the NFL ...
… have been as a backup QB.
But, hey, just for grins let’s take a look back on his football career and see if the injury label has been mis-applied to Mr. Croyle:
Let’s review …
2000: High school senior season ended by ACL injury in first game of season.
2003: During his first season starting for Alabama, suffered a separated shoulder and two cracked ribs in the 5th game. Didn’t quit, though, and the Tide slid to a 4-9 finish.
2004: Tore his ACL in the third game of the season.
2005: Started all 12 games for Alabama, but his injury history caused him to slide to the 3rd round of the 2006 NFL Draft.
2006: Played in 2 games for the KC Chiefs, going 3 for 7 for 23 yards and 2 INTs.
2007: Couldn’t win the starting job from Damon Huard, despite Herm Edwards trying to give it to him. Started his first home game on November 25 and promptly injured his back, causing him to sit out two weeks. Returned on December 9 and left the game with an injured hand, causing him to miss two more games. Returned in time to lost the last game of 2007 to the Jets.
2008: Entered the season as the starter. Left the opening game because of a bruised shoulder, causing him to miss four games. Returned to start in week 7, and on the 14th play of the game blew out his ACL and damaged his shoulder, causing him to miss the remainder of the season.
2009: Was the back-up for Matt Cassel, but stayed healthy the whole season.
Yep, clearly, he's as healthy as an ox.
by JacinB on Jun 14, 2010 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
But Damn he throws a nice ball!
And that’s all that matters, right? Just ask Jeff George.
Predictions:
This year will be better
Also ask KState product
Michael Bishop who could throw 250 yards backwards.
"One of the teams asked me a running back question," McCluster said. "They said when you have the ball, do you focus on the guy who's in front of you or the next guy.
"I told them 99% of the time, I'm going to make that first guy miss. Then, I'm onto the next."
by Matt_Grbac on Jun 14, 2010 2:52 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
i seem to remember a similar injury history from a qb named Trent Green
But damn he sure could play when he got the chance.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNm2rFzdvW8&feature=related
Uh, no.
No injuries of note in high school.
No injuries of note in four years of college (where he threw for 5,400 yards, 23 TDs and 32 INTs).
Was drafted in 1993 by the Chargers, cut in 1994 and went to the CFL for a season and then back to the NFL as a backup in Washington — four years with no significant injuries.
Started for the Redskins in 1998 and threw for 3,441 yards, 23 TDs and 11 INTs. Rejected a contract offer with the ’Skins to go to St. Louis.
Was slated to be the starter in 1999 with the Rams, but got taken out with a hit to the knee by Rodney Harrison and lost his job to Kurt Warner and was traded to KC in early 2000.
In 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005, Trent started for the Chiefs and had no significant injuries, starting 80 consecutive games during those five years. (Hardly a feat I can envision from Brodie.)
In 2006, he was knocked out of a game after suffering a severe concussion in the first game of the season. He came back in November.
He was traded in February 2007 to Miami after Damon Huard was signed to a ridiculously large contract and a minor QB controversy ensued. He suffered a second severe concussion in October 2007, and the Dolphins put him on the Injured Reserve.
Then, he came back to the Rams in 2008 as a back-up to Marc Bulger.
I’m not sure how you make a comparison between a guy who has suffered major injuries in 80% of the seasons he’s been a starter at QB at the collegiate or professional levels with a guy played in 80 consecutive games, but you feel free to go ahead and try.
by JacinB on Jun 14, 2010 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
All sports
You can hit 90% of your shots in basketball shoot around but if you can’t hit with a hand in your face it won’t matter.
You can hit 75 homers in batting practice but if you strikeout every time against opposing pitchers, you won’t play.
I really like Brodie and wanted him to be our long term starter when he was drafted in. But reality is that he can’t take a 16 game beat down. His body can’t take it. He is injury prone. He will always live with the “what if” stigma….
"One of the teams asked me a running back question," McCluster said. "They said when you have the ball, do you focus on the guy who's in front of you or the next guy.
"I told them 99% of the time, I'm going to make that first guy miss. Then, I'm onto the next."
by Matt_Grbac on Jun 14, 2010 1:01 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
yeah, he might ... because of attitudes like yours (he might be good but ...)
yanno what, I’d love to see the guy given a REAL chance … if he goes down then fine, he had a LEGITIMATE shot, but with the better line and RBs who actually BLOCK (unlike a certain 2.7 we all know and don’t love) imagine … just imagine …
true open competition and the BEST guy playing at EVERY position? come on …
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
Ups, Brodie did get chances, remember that crafty veteran Damon Huard? Brodie couldn't manage to pry the job from his grasp.
Not saying Brodie isn’t a decent QB but, just as the injury myths are out there, there are alot of people running with the myth that “he hasn’t gotten a real chance”.
"Crunch" Berry
"Duster" McCluster
No way is Ups Herm Edwards...... but he will prolly take that as a compliment.
Herm is a good man but a head coach he is not.
"Crunch" Berry
"Duster" McCluster
you bet I'd take it as a compliment ...
except I’m better looking than Herm … he does, however, have a better job than I do
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
I know ... brutal economy and job market these days, esp in my field (education)
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
You're exactly right.
Except that the injuries aren’t a myth.
In the 5 years he’s been a starter since college, he’s had season ending injuries in 3 of those years and a 4th year in which injuries should have ended his season but didn’t and his team suffered for it.
Brodies label of injury prone is well deserved.
You know the facts, i know the facts. Brodie has talent, but his biggest weakness is his ability to stay healthy. Whats that old quote, something about ignoring history then you are doomed to repeat it?
Don't blame me, I voted for content of character.
How did he not get a real chance in 2007?
You can complain all you want about the o line, but fact is Huard survived more games. Look at poor David Carr he was killed every play and still didnt have the injuries Croyle has had so far.
by groundedchevy on Jun 14, 2010 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions
My point is
I love me some Croyle at QB….BUT take your Croylenoculars off for a second!
He is too freaking small….his body is holding together by thumbtacks and super glue!
It’s reality buddy! Reality!
"One of the teams asked me a running back question," McCluster said. "They said when you have the ball, do you focus on the guy who's in front of you or the next guy.
"I told them 99% of the time, I'm going to make that first guy miss. Then, I'm onto the next."
by Matt_Grbac on Jun 14, 2010 1:53 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
You forgot: Anything negative about DJ and a Thiggy comment will still set it off too sometimes.
"Crunch" Berry
"Duster" McCluster
Paaaaalease!!!!!!
Peyton might….might be the next Thiggy….is more like it!
"One of the teams asked me a running back question," McCluster said. "They said when you have the ball, do you focus on the guy who's in front of you or the next guy.
"I told them 99% of the time, I'm going to make that first guy miss. Then, I'm onto the next."
by Matt_Grbac on Jun 14, 2010 1:50 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
He did have that 4 game stretch in 08
When he was the top QB
Check out my blog on software development:
http://www.turnleafdesign.com/
by Scaryclouds on Jun 14, 2010 2:42 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
no no no ... Thigpen's the next Fran Tarkenton
"I shall conquer untruth by truth" - Mahatma Gandhi
"It's always easier to sell 'em some shit than it is to give 'em the truth" - Shel Silverstein, The Perfect High
Whitlock Rocks!
hi, Mo! 5 minutes!!!
You also forgot that
QB out of Florida….what’s his name….dangit! Well who cares….
But wouldn’t it be funny if he played for a rival team of ours so the guys that like him would not know what to do when we played them….that would be great!!
"One of the teams asked me a running back question," McCluster said. "They said when you have the ball, do you focus on the guy who's in front of you or the next guy.
"I told them 99% of the time, I'm going to make that first guy miss. Then, I'm onto the next."
by Matt_Grbac on Jun 14, 2010 1:48 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Why don't we leave the predicting of the future to Miss Cleo
I like the fact Croyle has accepted the backup roll without bitching, demanding a trade or just plain saying screw it I’ve got a beautiful wife and money I quit. Nobody knows the future Croyle might stay healthy and he might not nobody knows for sure.
The most important thing you can do in life is help other people.
what we used to call
each other back in college: a practice all-american?
Just like novocaine. give it time; always works..
The greater the fall, the grander the ascention..
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