Big Plays Prop Up Chiefs' Offense in Loss to Rams
by Chris Thorman on Sep 4, 2009 6:59 AM CDT
in 2009 Training Camp
50 comments
When you take a look at the box score for the game between the Kansas City Chiefs and the St. Louis Rams, the first thing that will pop out at you is that the Chiefs had 402 total yards!
I know what you're thinking, "It's been so long since the Chiefs produced that many yards."
Well, no it hasn't been that long. The Chiefs put up 492 yards of offense last December in a loss to the Miami Dolphins. But it does seem like a lot of yards for an offense who hadn't produced more than 300 yards so far this preseason.
So did the Chiefs turn the corner on offense last night? Not exactly. Despite solid numbers in the box score, any observer of the game will tell you that the Chiefs still have big problems on offense. Don't believe the box score on this game.
One exercise I like to do after each game is if the team or a player has a big offensive performance, I take the yards away their one or two top gaining plays and see where they stand after that. It's an interesting way IMO to view how effective this quarterback or running back is for most of their plays.
Now if you're consistently making big plays and that accounts for a lot of yards, well then that's what we call good. The Chiefs' offense has not been good.
I take a look at the big plays after the jump. Let us know if you think these plays were flukes or if the Chiefs are on their way to becoming a real NFL offense.
Four Big Plays
You'll probably hear the local media talk about the four big offensive plays by the Chiefs last night. Those four plays accounted for 184 yards of offense - 46% of the total yards gained.
Here's how they went down:
Dantrell Savage - DS had the run of the preseason last night. The Chiefs had the ball on their own 2-yard line early in the second quarter when Brodie Croyle handed the ball off to Dantrell Savage. Savage broke through the middle of the line, spun around, bounced off of a couple of Rams to the right side of the field and just broke the run wide open. Savage wasn't able to outrun a couple of Rams defenders but he got pretty far. If he broke that for a TD, it would have been the play of the entire NFL preseason. Check out the highlight video of Savage's run here.
Sean Ryan - TE Sean Ryan is fighting for a roster spot and he got some big help from Brodie Croyle in the first quarter. Croyle hit Ryan for a 20-yard pass on the Chiefs' second drive of the game and then on the next drive hit him for the big one - a 40-yard catch and run down the middle of the field. You can watch that highlight here.
Larry Johnson - The next play after that Sean Ryan 40-yard catch was Larry Johnson busting through a big hole the o-line created for a 41-yard run. The Chiefs were at the Ram's 47-yard line and LJ almost had a TD but his football barely stepped out of bounds as he tiptoed the sidelines around the 5-yard line. That highlight is here.
Ashley Lelie - So the third quarter starts and it's all crazy Tyler Thigpen play. With about ten minutes to go and the Chiefs yet again starting inside their own 20-yard line, Thigpen gets about 12 seconds to throw the ball and flings a wounded duck 43-yards to Ashley Lelie. Could Thigpen do that again? Probably not. It was a heave and a lucky one at that.
So there's 184 yards of the Kansas City Chiefs offense in just four plays. The team had a total of 62 offensive plays.
My question to you this morning is: Can we say these plays were the result of our solid offensive play? Or were they just lucky plays and we should discount them in the team's overall offensive performance?
That's how I'm looking at these big plays this morning. Savage's run was more the result of poor tackling by the Rams than anything else. Sean Ryan's 40-yard pass did help set up a Ryan Succop field goal. Larry Johnson's efforts were soured near the goal line after his run. The Chiefs committed offensive holding and then a delay of game penalty pushed them back from the Rams 6-yard line to the 21-yard line. Thigpen's pass to Lelie was just slop.
As many players and media types are saying, this team has not found it's identity, especially on offense. We're inconsistent and downright amateur looking at times.
So AP readers, can the Chiefs survive the season on the random, lucky big play?
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I think those big plays were not flukes
except for Thigpen’s spectacularly ugly throw to Lelie. As the season progresses the KC offense will have big plays on a more regular basis as they get it together. The throw by Thigpen to Lelie, however, was WTF? Thigpen was really lucky this lame throw was not intercepted and returned for big yardage. Thigpen’s overall play was pretty lackluster, to say the least. Actually that is being too kind, he sucked.
by G.L. on Sep 4, 2009 7:14 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Maybe
he has broken ribs, a separated sholder, AND near sightedness?? Will have to ask his agent.
by BinSC on Sep 4, 2009 9:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rick, I'm not gonna beat around the bush here
“You got a great arm, onea the best I’ve ever seen, but your control hasn’t come around like we hoped…”
by ExtraMetal on Sep 4, 2009 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sigh...
Next sunday is going to be a tough one to watch. The Rams are as stinky as the Chiefs…
by IISaiNtII on Sep 4, 2009 7:15 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Savage’s run was more the result of poor tackling by the Rams than anything else.
I disagree…I can’t watch the highlight video to find out who it was, but right after Savage spun out of one tackle he was about to get wrapped up by, I think, a Rams safety…then whoever our WR was on the right side of the formation flew in and absolutely destroyed the defender – it was a fantastic block, and Savage was off to the races. Unfortunately, one of the CB’s had the angle.
Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.
by PVChiefsfan on Sep 4, 2009 7:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Great block
It was Mark Bradley… That’s the stuff Haley wants to see too
by Chieffan_Toby on Sep 4, 2009 7:21 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
I've been extremely impressed
with the blocking by of the wr corps. They can block better than the O line
by MTCHIEF on Sep 4, 2009 8:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was just wondering why no one was talking about the block.
Absolutely demolished the defender. Beautiful.
Oh, and what about that seam they opened up on LJ’s big run?!
Cantaloupe? More like wontaloupe. Lazy ass melons.
by cucuybird on Sep 4, 2009 7:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
seam was beautiful, and Larry showed some burst to get to the next level
that block was awesome, what I especially liked was that Savage either didn’t see it coming, or somehow saw the flash of red and knew not to break stride. I wonder if he saw bradley there or not, i didn’t see savage’s head swiveling. regardless…awesome block, awesome play, definitely someone fighting for their job
by thehulk on Sep 4, 2009 8:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LJ looked about as fast as I can remember.
Cantaloupe? More like wontaloupe. Lazy ass melons.
by cucuybird on Sep 4, 2009 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's a start!
4 big plays are better than none or a few. Good individual efforts contributed to them, as well as some decent blocking – so it was more than lucck. Have to start somewhere. Moving in the right direction, I’d say.
by JBChiefs on Sep 4, 2009 7:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
We can only hope Cassel gets back fast
and can stay healthy.
Herm is gone things are better with that one move!!
by bringbacktheglory on Sep 4, 2009 7:31 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I wonder how often when teams break 400 yards, it's, in part, due to several big plays...
My gut is that is often the case.
Also, when ever someone gives a yardage per play after taking away the biggest plays, I think, at the least, they should remove the same number of the worst plays before the average.
by timmer on Sep 4, 2009 7:58 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
my thoughts exacty
If you take away the couple big runs, you should also take away any times he’s stopped short due to poor run blocking, or just the couple worst runs.
unfortunately, the removal of the 0, or 1, or -2 yards won’t have nearly the effect of taking away a 20-80 yard big play…but in principle i definitely agree w/ you
by thehulk on Sep 4, 2009 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
as an unapologetic LJ hater,
I am excited to say, he definitely looked like he had some serious gas in the tank, and was pretty quick to the line. I saw none of what has soured me on him in the past – the sluggishness, getting stuffed at the line and then turning around and falling down, getting close to breaking it but just not being quick enough…he looked really good. Even on a couple of his short runs, he put his shoulder down, fell forward, that kind of good stuff. I hope I’m eating huge crow this season, because I have not liked or expected much from LJ for 2 years now. If, and this is a big IF, he’s back to old form, that is going to be HUGE for our offense. I think we’re going to continue to struggle getting the last 5 years when we’re in the red zone, but the LJ – Charles combo could be pretty legit. Yes there were exceptions, but overall in the first half I thought our run blocking was very good.
As for the big plays, I would imagine that any time a runner has 100+ yards its because of at least one big play. Absolutely there’s value to analyze what someone did on the OTHER 20-25 runs, were they all for 2.1 yards, but we definitely need to keep the big plays in there as products of good execution. Skill breeds luck in the NFL, yes there’s just some dumb luck out there, but on LJ’s big run there was a great hole and a clear seam for him to take off.
by thehulk on Sep 4, 2009 8:00 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
biggest play of the night
croyle got hit and continued to play. such as it was.
by ExtraMetal on Sep 4, 2009 8:17 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If it was only 1 or 2
But 4 big gains are a sign of good plays being called and executed correctly. Savage broke two tackles but the other plays were just executed the way they should have been. I think we are seeing small signs of life, IF the O-line gets it together a little I think we will be fine on offense this year.
by tevans96 on Sep 4, 2009 8:23 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
De
defenses breakdown, that’s the way of most big plays—taking advantage
by FrankPitts on Sep 4, 2009 8:42 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The starting O-line showed quite a bit of improvement last night.
Remember, they were only in for about two series. They were the ones who broke LJ free and bought Croyle the time to get the throw out to Ryan.
After that, not so much but, if we get that kind of play from the starters every week, we’ll be just fine.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 4, 2009 8:43 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree
Run blocking was solid.
Pass protection was adequate, with the exception of the occasional whiff at RT.
I’m perfectly fine with some big plays on offense, for once. If LJ averages 3 ypc, but breaks a 40 yd run once a game, that’s fantastic.
There could have been 4 or 5 more big plays, but the QB was just off. Bowe would have had 3 TD, but they missed him when he was open several times.
Get Cassel in there, get some timing down… this offense will be just fine.
As long as they keep running the ball, and stopping the run… and sprinkle in a couple of big plays per game… they can reach 8-8 or 9-7.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Sep 4, 2009 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1 Stag
I was really hoping to see better play from Croyle though. honestly, that was my biggest disappointment because I know he can play better than that. If he would just put a little more touch on some of his passes and not try to wing it every time, He would be stellar.
If Croyle plays in week 1, I predict he will play better by then having had more time to prepare and get his timing down.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 4, 2009 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was actually not too
disapointed in Croyle. A lot of zip on his passes. The kid has the arm. He tooks some pretty good hits and got up. It just looked like he hasn’t had much game action in awhile. That will come.
I thought the running game was improved because of the more aggressive downfield throws. Couldn’t sit 10 yards off the line of scrimmage all game. Bet Herm was having a cow!
by BinSC on Sep 4, 2009 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There were some beautiful plays on O and D.
I have to remind myself what team they were against. It doesn’t make the plays any less pretty, but it does make me wonder if they can be duplicated against some of the teams we will face this season.
We still haven’t scored a TD against a 1st team defense.
by NJ Chiefs Fan on Sep 4, 2009 8:47 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
A sad fact
While I am cautiously optimistic about the defense, I have to say that I’m pretty pessimistic about the offense. Our defense (1st, 2nd & 3rd teams) held the Rams to 7 points. They were rewarded for their effort by the offense scoring only 2 points.
Our offense only accounted for 2 measly points in the game. If you count the 9 points on 3 FGs, then you have to subtract the 7 points given up on 1 INT. This also doesn’t not account of the numerous missteps made on offense. These problems include turnovers & penalties that ended drives that could’ve resulted in more points…
I do recognize that preseason is what it is; however, I also think that our Coaching staff really intended to win 1 of these 4 games (hard to change a losing culture by continuing to lose). So, its a sobering fact that we didn’t win when we had more than a few opportunities.
I hate to be the gloomy gus here, but I think this needs to be said. I look for Haley & Pioli to really shake up the offense here in the first few weeks of the season, else it will be a long, cold winter…
"Every day is an evaluation and if you’re not out there how can we depend on you? If you’re out there and you don’t know what to do, how can we depend on you?" Accountability -- Haley-style...
by Chief_Elmo on Sep 4, 2009 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So what is the measure of good offense?
Yards, in any form are nice. But this team needs POINTS.
Like any other sporting event most all participants have moments of good solid play and moments of luck or good fortune.
Winners turn that luck into opportunity and capitalize on it.
So what happened last night? What has happened for two years running? Yes good solid play has went down, but also there has not been any capitalizing on the good bounce of the ball.
My barometer is did they take advantage of those big plays?
The answer was clearly NO.
by BCRavenJHawkfan on Sep 4, 2009 8:49 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh dear god
the new name for my fantasy football team is FML Chiefs. This is going to be like going through growing pains this year. I’m thinking we may win 4 or 5 games. Yes an improvement over last year, but not as much as us Chiefs fans would hope for.
by Primmtime on Sep 4, 2009 8:50 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
End Zone
It worries me that there are so few offensive TDs this preseason. Why can we not get it in the end zone? I will be at the opening game against the Ravens (I live in Baltimore) and I fear for how the offense will look against a top 10 D. My only hope is that Cassel comes back strong and can take control of the offense and LJ continues to play hard. Without that, it may be another long season. Keep hope alive!!
by PC10 on Sep 4, 2009 9:03 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Thigpen
I think Thigpen played his way off the team last night, I bet he gets cut.
by Digital on Sep 4, 2009 9:12 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I just watched a little of the replay
on NFL Network before work. Did I see Waters playing center with Washington at guard for awhile? Interesting idea. Waters has played there before and would sure help with the rush in the face of the QB.
by BinSC on Sep 4, 2009 9:28 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Thigpen=gone
I’m tired of all this gloom and doom. I saw a lot of improvement last night on offense. The difference of having Haley calling plays was HUGE. Much more aggressive. Our offense had more big plays in one game than we have gotten in the last three combined. We didn’t get in the endzone but, that was mostly because of a penalty in the red zone. That can be fixed. Remember, Croyle is just a temporary qb. Cassel will be back by the time we play Oakland and he will complete the passes Brodie missed on.
I am NOT bashing Brodie either. He didn’t have a very good night tonight but, he was and is WAAAAY better than Thigpen. By the time we play Baltimore, Croyle will be clicking with the #1 offense. The O-line play of the starters was way better too. They just didn’t stay in the game long enough to get a good look.
It will take a few weeks to get this rolling but, this team is much better than what we had last year. We still need a RT though.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 4, 2009 9:34 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Curious
Do you think it was improved play on the part of the Chiefs offense or just the fact we played a pathetic team? Hard to judge progress in a game like this. If we played the same way against the Steelers would you feel better about the team or the same?
It’s why I don’t put too much stock in pre-season. The Rams just went 3-1, but you know they are going to suck.
by BinSC on Sep 4, 2009 9:44 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
that's got to be a factor
but, it’s a confidence builder, either way
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Sep 4, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Play call creates opportunities
Whether they were all executed properly or not Haley’s play calling definitely opened up the field. He was having them pass down field all day. We haven’t seen that in four years. As soon as the defense had to spread out and prepare for that it opened up more opportunities for the running game.
Last year every pass was for 2-4 yards. The opposing teams could sit within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage and cover everything we threw at them.
Still not convinced Haley should be doing all the work – but his philosophy on offense should help our O-line and our running game.
by akgrenier on Sep 4, 2009 9:50 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
A few big plays is the diff in almost every NFL game
Sick of hearing you have to throw out the big plays when analyzing the performance, that’s a bunch of crap.
So many people have been saying that we lost so many games last year by 6 points.
Herm’s defense, “Hey we did a really great job of stopping them except for that 56yd run for a TD in the 2nd Quarter and that 64 pass for a TD in the 4th, other than that the Defense played great.” How many times did we hear that?
The cliches are true; football is a game of inches and moments. The difference makers in the Superbowl last year.
1 unbelievable 100yard defensive TD
2 Fitzgerald splitting the #1 defense in the leage to go ahead
3 Steelers last second TD to win, tip toe catch side of the endzone.
The Steelers just had 1 more big play than the other team. The fact of the matter is, that’s usually how it happens.
by Your_Moms_Boyfriend on Sep 4, 2009 11:09 AM CDT reply actions 5 recs
wrecked.
One more turns it green. Can we get one more??
by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 4, 2009 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wrecktastic
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Sep 4, 2009 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was watching the news last night
and they reported that Succop outscored the rest of the team this preseason. Now that is a sad fact! I think it was 27 points for Succop and 18 for the rest of the team. Now come on, its preseason, shouldn’t we be actually working on scoring?
by Primmtime on Sep 4, 2009 11:11 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately
This team has so many other things to work on, scoring has taken a back seat. (note the sarcasm.)
ps…thanks herm
by DWWMRW on Sep 4, 2009 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
thats funny
usually kickers lead the team in points, or most times…but they dont lead the rest of the team combined…yeesh
by SDChief on Sep 4, 2009 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
imo
battle almost took a screen for a TD
LJ run couldve been six
d-washington couldve picked six.
big plays were missed in my opinion.
my issue with the savage run is the lack of pure long range speed. LJ impressed with agility on the sidelines
honestly this game was very encouraging all around.
by SDChief on Sep 4, 2009 11:44 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Definitely encouraging.
The ones played well on both sides IMO.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 4, 2009 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
hey everyone knew to the site and would haft to agree SDChief was encouraging all around and i really feel like we would have won the game if old thiggy hadnt gift wrapped it up for the rams he gave up three less points then our D the D looked pretty solid and only gave up ten points and at the end of the game we would have kicked the game winning field goal vs goin for it on 4 and 8
by 09Chiefs!! on Sep 4, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
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