Haley and Vermeil Both Show Emotion, But...

by Rev. Slappy on Sep 24, 2009 2:11 AM CDT

Just something I was thinking about: we've been debating Haley's coaching style a lot this week and I was reading posts written in response to the Mike Lombardi piece about Haley. People are defending or condemning Haley showing so much emotion openly and it made me think of Dick Vermeil. Vermeil also wore his emotions on his sleeve, but in pretty much the opposite way as Haley: Vermeil cried. He cried a lot. And perhaps there was criticism of it that I don't remember. But, I don't remember Vermeil being under this kind of a microscope for his emotional outbursts.

I think this is an interesting idea to discuss. Are Haley's emotional outbursts really that different than Vermeil's? Was Vermeil "unmanly" for being so weepy? Did players lose respect for Vermeil? Is there a double standard when it comes to Haley?

I don't know the answers to those questions. Any thoughts on the subject?

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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True...

I prefer it when the comparisons to Cowher come up though. Or for that matter, Schottenheimer (sorry if that’s mispelled). i can’t think of a game Marty went without screaming at somebody. After a while you got used to it, and you knew when the camera was gonna switch to him screaming at somebody. It’s nothing new for KC fans or the NFL in general, and I think it’s rediculous that Haley gets such attention for it.

by Archyrr on Sep 24, 2009 2:57 AM CDT reply actions

I think that's a fair question....

I wonder if they did’t lose a little respect for him for being a bit of a crybaby? I don’t know, But I think he may have gotten a pass because he won alot of football games, Haley will earn his pass when he wins alot of games. And if I had to deal with an emotional outburst, I’d rather feel a little akward because a grown man is crying rather than getting pissed someone is screaming at me.

by callmesir on Sep 24, 2009 4:38 AM CDT reply actions

Fair points.

It did seem to get mentioned a lot about Vermeil’s emotional state. Your probably right, it was looked at favorably because of the high flying offense we had and the wins. Personally, I wouldn’t mind the crying for positive stuff, but I wouldn’t want a coach/boss ect crying about things going wrong. Gotta stay strong there. Not saying Vermeil did that, just an example.

On the other end of things, I think screaming is situational as well. It’s certainly not the leadership style you want to see day after day, I know I’d get pissed off myself after a while. But it’s valid in certain circumstances. When you’re a bonehead(Croyle’s delay of game, the touchback circle jerk, ect), you deserve a good dressing down. Besides, it’s Arrowhead, I would almost question them being able to hear each other down on the field at times.

I’m hoping we see some of the same signs we did during training camp, and as things improve (no stupid mistakes), he lightens up. Both for the sake of our players and Haley himself, as well as the fact that if he’s lightening up, good things must be happening.

Just my thoughts.

by Archyrr on Sep 24, 2009 5:41 AM CDT up reply actions

Did you not watch the Chiefs when Vermeil was here.

He didn’t cry on the field he would scream at the players that messed up too.
I know you have been down on Haley for his coaching style. and I don’t know how long you have been a Chief Fan but for 20 years that I have been watching all of our HC have been the in your face coach when someone messed up except for Herm and is it a coincidence that the Herm era was the worse in franchise history. Just something to think about.

Herm is gone things are better with that one move!!

by bringbacktheglory on Sep 24, 2009 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions

I agree 100% BBTG

I remember seeing Vermiel screaming at guys on the sidelines all the time…Refs too.

Herm never did and THAT is probably one of the reasons these players got so soft.

by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 24, 2009 8:57 AM CDT up reply actions

There were (& are) clips

of Vermeil’s rants in the lockerroom before games getting the guys pumped up that would make some think he was a total nut case and he was (& is) known as one of the greatest motivators of all time. He also ranted & raved a lot on the sidelines & in players faces all the time but he did have his history at UCLA & at Philadelphia to give him his creds!
It was in the news conferences where he would get weepy! He definitely got emotional when talking about his players because he cared so much.
Don’t forget Vince Lombardi! He was as close to a dictator as you could be as a football coach, & he seemed to do OK.

by ttownmikey on Sep 24, 2009 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions

I think when when it all boils down to it

until one of us here are named the next GM, and get to select or retain our own head coach, it is what it is and we just have to accept it if we are going to continue to be fans of the Chiefs. Me personally, I have no problem with the way Haley coaches. We gave Herm three years and could only sink just a little further into a black hole, and there are many who still think he should have been retained anoither year.

Many say a team takes on the personality of their head coach and what you said of Vermeil could be a good point. When it came time for the playoffs other teams knew we would break down and cry. Commenters on here have mentioned Ray Lewis as a great “on field” coach, how many think he hasnt slung a cuss word or two when one of his team mates screws up? “Oh butterfly its ok that the other teams guy just ran over you, lets get the band aids out for your boo boo and dont worry about the 6 points, we will go over to the sidelines and cheer our team on! Yay Go Ravens” (as he does a high kick like a cheerleader while running off the field)

Winning begins with Attitude - 2009 Chiefs 12-4

by Lanier63 on Sep 24, 2009 8:42 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs

I'm a bit of a conspiracy theory guy so my theory on this may be a little irrational but...

I think right now, it is en vogue to badmouth the Chiefs in the media. we are a small market team so, nobody really cares. Wer’e not winning much either so nobody really cares about that either. Plain and simple, we are a very easy target. They can talk bad about our team, our record, our coach, and there are no real repercussions. They won’t get a lot of hate mail or phone calls from the league because, to be honest, other than inside KC and here on AP, nobody really gives a SHIT about the Chiefs.

Once Haley starts winning games, all this talk will stop. When he has shown that e is a good coach, this will all go from criticism to praise. Not only from us fans but also from the media as well. He still has to prove himself though.

by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 24, 2009 9:07 AM CDT reply actions

Thanks for the comments Chiefs...

Your theory is probably pretty correct, but as you stated He still has to prove himself, but we HAVE to give him that chance also. Two games and preseason is not a chance to draw any type of conclusion. Lets all talk in January. :)

Winning begins with Attitude - 2009 Chiefs 12-4

by Lanier63 on Sep 24, 2009 9:21 AM CDT up reply actions

BTW: Check out the fanshots.

There is a really good article by a Philly reporter that is VERY complimentary of the Chiefs. He thinks the Eagles might be getting trapped this weekend.

by Chiefsfan1970 on Sep 24, 2009 9:32 AM CDT reply actions