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lets correct some things

After Reading NJChiefsFan's post about the Raiders being the second best team in the AFC West, and after reading all of your comments i decided to so some research. what i found is actually a bit of a suprise. 

take this for instance-  Chiefs and New England stats here (from ESPN.com).

Chiefs-

Passing Statistics
NAME CMP ATT YDS CMP% YDS/A LNG TD TD% INT INT% SACK YDS RAT
Tyler Thigpen 230 420 2608 54.8 6.21 75 18 4.3 12 2.9 26 162 76.0
Damon Huard 50 81 477 61.7 5.89 68 2 2.5 4 4.9 9 56 65.7
Brodie Croyle 20 29 151 69.0 5.21 22 0 0.0 0 0.0 1 10 81.3
Quinn Gray 7 8 76 87.5 9.50 26 1 12.5 0 0.0 0 0 145.8
Mark Bradley 1 1 37 100.0 37.00 37 1 100.0 0 0.0 0 0 158.3
Marques Hagans 1 1 5 100.0 5.00 5 0 0.0 0 0.0 1 1 87.5
Larry Johnson 1 1 4 100.0 4.00 4 1 100.0 0 0.0 0 0 122.9
Totals 310 541 3358 57.3 6.21 75 23 4.3 16 3.0 37 229 77.5




New England-

Passing Statistics
NAME CMP ATT YDS CMP% YDS/A LNG TD TD% INT INT% SACK YDS RAT
Matt Cassel 327 516 3693 63.4 7.16 76 21 4.1 11 2.1 47 219 89.4
Tom Brady 7 11 76 63.6 6.91 26 0 0.0 0 0.0 0 0 83.9
Kevin O'Connell 4 6 23 66.7 3.83 12 0 0.0 0 0.0 1 2 73.6
Kevin Faulk 1 1 -2 100.0 -2.00 -2 0 0.0 0 0.0 0 0 79.2
Totals 339 534 3790 63.5 7.10 76 21 3.9 11 2.1 48 221 89.1

What i found interesint in these stats when you compare the is the sack totals.  Matt Cassel was actually sacked more that Tyler Thigpen.  you may be thinking so what? NE still had a better line.  that may be the case, however NE had a better run game last year and a strong run game helps out any offensive line.

more after the jump.

Star-divide

A look at the two teams starting QB's

Chiefs-

Tyler Thigpen 62 386 6.2 32 3 4 2

New England-

Matt Cassel 73 270 3.7 19 2 2 0

What some people may not know (until now) is that Tyler Thigpen were one and two respectively in rushing yards for QB's.  you may think that this doesnt change anything as far as the QB battle, and honestly it doesnt.  but what it does to is bring another element to the chiefs offense.  matt cassel under center and  tyler thigpen spread out wide creates a whole host of problems for defenses.  even if its a bluff play they have to worry about covering  two QB's( both of which can obviously run the ball)  the recievers the runningback.  m not saying it will happen but its a possibility.

Randy Moss VS. Dwayne BoweRandy Moss-

YEAR TEAM G REC YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
1998 MIN 16 69 1313 19.0 61 17 51 1 0
1999 MIN 16 80 1413 17.7 67 11 52 1 1

Dwayne Bowe-

YEAR TEAM G REC YDS AVG LNG TD FD FUM LOST
2007 KAN 16 70 995 14.2 58 5 51 0 0
2008 KAN 16 86 1022 11.9 36 7 49 0 0

Not alot to say here really, i just wanted to show you Randy moss's first two years in the leauge compared to Dwayne Bowe's.  i was actually supresed at how clost the stats really are and give me alot of hope for Dwayne Bowe, as long as he keeps ahold of the ball.

 

Expect the 2009 chiefs to be alot more determined to show what kind of team they truly are.  we all know they have the talent to succeed, and the stats seem to support it.  with all the conditioning and more uptight practices this year i expect the chiefs to close out games and be more Mentally tough.  with the additions in the offseason this team has some true leadership.  i can see the chiefs making major strides through out the 2009 season.  the Chiefs WILL NOT allow the raiders to be second in the AFC WEST.

GO CHIEFS!

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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One of the things Cassel has to work on

Is holding onto the ball too long. NFL.com referred to it as well the other day and I guess his passer rating against the blitz is pretty bad(25ish?). Holding onto the ball results in more sacks. Also I think their line had some injuries to deal with last year.

The stat comparisons of Moss and Bowe are interesting. Id expect him to take the next step this year too not only because its his third year but because of Haleys tutelage.

by GenericBrand on Jun 19, 2009 12:45 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

I trust Haley to coach him but Cassell still has to make the reads.

Warner in Arizona was great at getting rid of the ball quick, now we’ll see if was him or the coaching.

by Helmets on Jun 19, 2009 8:11 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm going to agree somewhat but it's debateable to a point.

In St. Louis he gave up quite a few sacks despite having a great Oline and a great running game. I do think he was better there at getting the ball out when things were going well in StLouis but when they started to drop off it got bad. He ate 21 sacks in 7 games his second to last year. Then remember the Giants fiasco? He had trouble with holding onto the ball too long there for sure. When he went to AZ he got back to his old early Rams day form pretty quick so maybe Haley helped remind him what he was doing right.

by GenericBrand on Jun 19, 2009 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ya gotta set the table for a great pocket passer.

No pocket – no passer. Warner’s fortunes rise and fall with his o-line and receiving weapons.

by hmills110 on Jun 19, 2009 6:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

thats gonna make or break Cassel

He cannot not afford to hold on to the football for too long.
Thats something he is going to have to work on in camp,
Making quick reads and deciding what to do with the ball
Either scrambling away and picking up yards himself or just throwing the ball into the turf.

If he loses the ball with fumbles that can destroy any chance of confidence on the offense.

Before you build yourself up, you must tear somebody else down.

by Zennedy on Jun 21, 2009 7:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Same could be said of any QB.

I think he’ll be OK. But I have little, beyond Haley’s reputation, to suggest they’re gonna light it up in the air any time soon. It looks to be some tough sloggin’ underneath and on the ground, until they show us sum’m.

by hmills110 on Jun 21, 2009 9:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

doesnt matter if their line had injuries or not.

every so called “expert” knocks on KC for sacks allowed and rightfully so, however kc wasnt the worst and with the addition of Goff and better conditioning this line will be better. they should atleast acknowledge this much and not bash all the time.

by chiefs8288 on Jun 19, 2009 3:16 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Right Guard

Another thing people seem to do a lot is bash Rudy and Damian all the time. But I was listening to the Red Zone when Mitch Holtus was on there and he made the comment that probably the worst position on the team last year was RG. With the addition of Goff and dropping Adrian we just got an enormous upgrade to the line. With C and RT both having a year of experience now and a solid RG between them, we have the makings of a real line. Add in a line coach with a great record and things are looking up. Solid line play = better QB play + better holes for RB. Looks to me like the offense will be much more consistent which will automatically make the defense have more breathing room. If the D can generate turnovers like they did last year, this years offense may actually be able to score some points off of them. I’m excited about the prospects.

by Zodeman on Jun 19, 2009 7:25 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

good points

There are a lot of factors that go into scoring than just the QB and #1 WR stats.

Cassel does need to get the ball out quicker this year, but I think he’ll improve in that area with more experience and comfort as an NFL starter.

Bowe does need to control the dropped passes, but he should do that with more focus and better coaching… and EVEN if he doesn’t… he’s still among the better receivers in the league this year.

The Chiefs OL should be much improved this year, barring any major injuries. Albert has a year of starting under his belt, as does Rudy… which should make both of them much better. They are very smart and tough players, so I expect them both to be very solid. Waters and Goff give the line 2 of the better, experienced guards. My question is still around Sackintosh at RT… Yes, Goff will help the right side of the line… but I’d like to see one of the young guys step up and take over RT.

by stagdsp on Jun 19, 2009 8:50 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Interior line play is necessary, but not sufficient.

Even if nothing else changes, the line will be better than last season, just by fixing its biggest weakness. But you can NEVER be too good at offensive tackle, and I’m with you, stagdsp, in wondering if/when the other shoe is gonna drop at OT. From what most are saying, the best candidate for starting RT is Herb Taylor, but he’s penciled-in as Alberts backup. I can see Colin Brown getting some snaps in a utility capacity, but he’s likely to struggle as much or more than Sackintosh in pass protection.

by hmills110 on Jun 19, 2009 6:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Moss vs. Bowe

Receptions and yards may not be far apart, but look at the TD column.

In their rookie seasons Moss had more than three times as many TD’s as Bowe did.

Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.

by PVChiefsfan on Jun 19, 2009 7:54 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i agree, he killed him in the touchdown catagory

Moss is the man though. Your stoked if your a qb throwing to him. He is what makes me put a big ? on Cassel.

by chiefskingfromcali on Jun 22, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Bowe’s not even on the same planet as Moss was his first two seasons.

by burntorangehorn on Jun 19, 2009 11:09 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Bowe has CRAZY potential but...

he has a long way to go still. i posted a comment the other day about Bowe not being a real threat for opposing defenses. I still stand on that. If Bowe becomes more consistent, it will open up the rest of our playbook offensively. As of right now, teams don’t respect our passing attack and they crowd the box because truly, LJ IS our biggest offensive threat.
If Haley can find ways to get D-Bowe open and get the ball to him, teams will have to respect our passing game. They will have to game plan around stopping D-bowe and our running game can return to what it should be. At the very least, it can be respectable.

by Chiefsfan1970 on Jun 19, 2009 12:42 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Bowe and Moss

They are very different types of receivers.

See the Yards per catch…
Moss 17-19
Bowe 11-14

Moss is your classic “deep threat” kind of player

Bowe is more similar to a fitzgerald or Boldin… a guy that can go up in traffic and make the tough catch. A Receiver that should be bigger and stronger than the DB he’s up against.

apples and oranges.

by stagdsp on Jun 19, 2009 1:18 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

+1

Yup. That’s right on

Braccae illae virides cum subucula rosea et tunica Caledonia-quam elenganter concinnatur!

by Buck'O on Jun 19, 2009 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Glad to hear the o-line talk.

I guess I’m not alone in the wilderness on the comparisons of Cassel and Thigpen and the offensive line sitch for both last year. The situation in which both Thiggy and Cassel found themselves and the way they responded were very very similar, and now the Chiefs have what I consider to be a 2-headed monster at QB. Take one of ’em out, and another guy just like him steps in.

This “holding the ball too long” discussion is nonsense. Warner’s been the same great QB (with limited mobility) that he’s been for years. We give the QB too many kudos for success and too much criticism for failure. Give him decent protection, and Warner’s a Pro-Bowler. Most of the “he holds it too long” plays are busted protections, and half the time, when the pass is STILL completed (against the odds), we sing the QB’s praises for having the guts to take the big hit. From the QB position the good ones and bad ones prob’ly look pretty much the same from where he’s standing (and falling), but we’ll diss him for the ones that hit the ground and sing his praises for the ones that don’t. We fans can’t have it both ways, even if we insist on it. It is what it is, and not what we imagine it was.

Bowe needs to run better routes and improve his concentration on the catch. But he’s still not a threat to get behind the D quickly, like a Moss or Fitzgerald. He’ll have to make most of his hay on shorter, quicker stuff that he can turn upfield. Whether there’s time for a decent double-move will be riding on the play fake, the o-line, and LJ.

So until/unless Darling/Bradley challenge secondaries with some speed, defenses will be able to cheat towards the line. Defenses may feel like they need to honor Bowe’s routes, but his lack of consistency tells Cassel/Thigpen to either ignore him on 3rd down, or accept that fact that a lot of drives are going to grind to a halt when the ball hits the ground. That’s the difference between great stats and winning football. We got rid of one stats phenom in losing efforts and hope that the other stats phenom will develop into a winner.

by hmills110 on Jun 19, 2009 3:40 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

+1

Clearly thought out and not just kool-aie

is it me? or isn't about time the Lamar Hunt trophy belonged to His team?

by KC Fanatic on Jun 20, 2009 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i'll let the raiders be second in the afc west

the Chiefs WILL NOT allow the raiders to be second in the AFC WEST.

i’ll let the raiders be second in the afc west because we’ll be first ;)

by airfly on Jun 19, 2009 5:56 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

+1 ExACTly!

Chargers flounder. Turner fired after midseason, with 2-8 record.

by hmills110 on Jun 19, 2009 6:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I do think that 9-7 may win this division...And yes the chargers are on the decline

but it’s unlikely they’ll finish below 9-7..Too much talent there..I could see the raiders winning an extra game or two and the broncos finishing around 6-10 due to losing there best player..

This division is shaping up to be the weakest division in the NFL.

by CALIFAN1986 on Jun 20, 2009 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It has fallen so far. It used to be in perennial contention for the strongest division, but now it’s almost a laughingstock. San Diego is the only team in the division that looks like it might have a shot at a winning record, and even then it’ll only be if they can squeeze one more good year out of aging stars.

by burntorangehorn on Jun 21, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pundits are usually a year behind the curve.

As others have said, these league-wide projections are VERY broad-brush, and the W-L from the past may be the indicator on which they rely the most. Based on our recons (Keep ‘em up, Steve!), I’m getting the impression that the Faders and Chiefs will be the ones to surprise, if anybody does. I think the Chargers are going to have their asses handed to ‘em, and I have nothing but skepticism about McDaniels in Denver. He’s doing all the “out of his depth” things I was afraid I’d see from Haley… and didn’t.

by hmills110 on Jun 21, 2009 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

So....

Did we actually correct anything here? =P

Braccae illae virides cum subucula rosea et tunica Caledonia-quam elenganter concinnatur!

by Buck'O on Jun 23, 2009 10:24 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

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