Comparing KC and Arz front 7 and why we should pass on Curry and trade down.
by KCporkchop on Mar 14, 2009 9:50 PM CDT
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PrintAfter reading the article describing the hybrid 3-4/4-3 that Arz. ran last year I decided to compare their front seven from last year to who we currently have on the roster to see where the biggest holes are. Here is the break down by position (at least as I am understanding them to be in the hybrid system):
LDE - Antonio Smith - 6'4", 285 - 41 tk 4 sacks
I take this to be a cross between your standard DE and the DE in a 3-4. I think this one has to be Turk (some may say Boone, but I'd rather give the young guy a shot).
Turk McBride - 6'2", 278 - 41 tk 0 sacks
NT - Bryan Robinson - 6'4", 304 - 20 tk 1 sack
Not your traditional NT, doesn't usually line up over the center. Some may say Dorsey here, I'll explain why I didn't in a moment. I'm going with Tank.
Tank Tyler - 6'2", 306 - 41 tk 0 sacks
UT - Darnell Dockett - 6'4", 285 - 49 tk 4 sacks
This "Under Tackle" is a cross between a 4-3 DT and a 3-4 DE. If you watched Arz in the playoffs Dockett was their most dissruptive DL member. I like Tank at nose and Dorsey here better then Dorsey at NT and your choice of Tank, Boone, or Edwards at UT. Dorsey is shorter then Dockett but has more bulk.
Glenn Dorsey - 6'1", 297 - 46 tk 1 sack
RDE (AKA the Predator) - Bertand Berry - 6'3", 260 - 22 tk 5 sacks
This is a cross between your 4-3 DE and OLB in a 3-4. The article states that this position's main goal is to blitz the QB. This is where things get tricky. I see three guys on the current roster who could play here: Hali, Babin, and Vrabel. I think Vrabel could be better here, however Hali has no where else to play and we are weak at LB so I'll go with Hali.
Tamba Hali - 6'3", 275 - 54 tk 3 sacks
MLB - Gerald Hayes - 6'1" 249 - 88 tk 0 sacks
I picked this LB spot to cover first because this is where the problem is. The article describes this position as a "thumper", a big guy who can handle OG who come unblocked. I think this is a waste of DJ to put him here. He's better in space and is not what I would call a thumper. Pat Thomas didn't work in my opinion so by default I'm putting Vrabel here. It may not be his ideal spot but he has played inside before and I don't see any other option on the roster.
Mike Vrabel - 6'4", 261 - 62 tk 4 sacks
SLB - Chike Okeafor 6'5", 247 - 60 tk 4 sacks
The "Sam" in this system seems to line up like an OL in the 3-4 the majority of the time as far as I can tell. On the Arz team roster Okeafor is actually lister as a DE. If we had a MLB I think this is Vrabel's true position. However, since we don't I'm looking at DJ, D. Williams, and Babin. I think Williams is too small for the "sam". So it's either DJ here and Williams at the "Will" or Babin here and DJ at the "Will". People may not agree but I'll take Babin in the starting line up over Williams, mainly because I really like DJ at the "Will".
Jason Babin - 6'3", 260 - 31 tk 2 sacks
WLB - Karlos Dansby - 6'4" 250 - 119 tk 4 sacks
In this system the "will" seems to be the one free to get after the ball and make plays. Of anyone on our current roster that has to be DJ.
Derrick Johnson - 6'3", 242 - 85 tk 2 sacks
So here's my final thoughts regarding what we need to do to make this system work for us. I LOVE Curry. I think he looks like a sure fire pro bowl calliber LB. However, where does he play? To me, it would be a waste to play him anywhere but the "Will". Then where do we play DJ? I stand by my position that he's not cut out to play the "Mike" in this system. He might be okay at the "Sam", but I feel like that is where Vrabel should play. If we were to trade down and get a true MLB then both Vrabel and DJ could play in their natural spots and Hali and Babin could rotate at the "Predator". To me that fits this system best and uses our current players at the best possible positions. It also would allow us to pick up another pick or two to add depth. So there you go, have at me.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.
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yeah I like it
Dorsey has found a home!
Time is a great teacher... unfortunately it kills all it's pupils.
I agree
that if we stay put at #3 and he’s there he is too good to pass up. However, if this is the system we’re running then Curry is best suited for the same position as our best current LB, Johnson. So if someone is willing to pony up and give us some quality picks to move down we could get more players and ones that fit our holes better.
Ten sacks in a season! For crying out loud that's what I used to average per game using DT in Tecmo Bowl!
HEY.....
After hearing all this stuff about how S.Pioli doesnt want to sign a bunch of all pro players,wouldnt it make sense that instead of drafting A.curry who is a excellent player that he would trade down if he could and try to get 2 good players?Isnt that how the Pats did it ?What do you guys think about trading down to get Clay Matthews there saying that the texans are going to pick him at #15. I think he would be a great player at MLB. Rey Maualuga is another one i like at MLB and he is going at #23 to the PATS. Also James Laurinaitis he is going at #33 all of this of coarse is from the mock draft.I think it would help us more if we could trade down and get a MLB , dont get me wrong A.curry is the LB out there but i would be happy with a Clay Matthews and another pick to boot.
It could make sense
The problem is it is very hard to trade out of the #3 position, but I wouldn’t be against it if we could pick up a few picks. it would all depend on what we could get for the spot
Maualuga
will never get past the Broncos assuming they keep Jay Cutler, if they don’t keep Cutler Maualuga is still an option but it will most likely be Sanchez
Time is a great teacher... unfortunately it kills all it's pupils.
RDE is a problem...
Babin is a much better DE than Turk, hands down. Turk disappears in traffic and tends to get washed a lot. He also is a little shorter than i would like for an NFL DE with avg-below avg speed. (speed can make up for size a la Freeney, Mathis). Babin is rangier and already has a better stable of inside and outside pass-rush moves, IF we resign him i see big things for him. You also leave Darrell Robertson out of any of your plans…i’m telling you, he can PLAY…
"A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week."
Confused
The RDE is the “predator” position. A hybrid of DE and OLB. No way Turk could play that spot. If you want to say Babin should start over Hali there, I’d here your argument. I have Turk at LDE which is more of a 3-4 DE so it needs size (like Turk has, Babin doesn’t). Don’t get me wrong I’m not big on Turk I’m just trying to see what guys we have that fit this system.
Ten sacks in a season! For crying out loud that's what I used to average per game using DT in Tecmo Bowl!
Jason Taylor might fit here?
He has experience in the 3-4 at both spots DE and OLB?
by A true chiefs fan on Mar 15, 2009 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions
My thoughts
Curry at Will, Vrabel at Mike, Johnson at Sam
Dorsey at weak side DE, Tyler at NT
We have no legit options at strong side DE, Hali by default, maybe McBride
We have no legit Predator/WOLB at all. Curry could be 3rd down Predator leaves another hole.
Curry, Vrabel, and Johnson
would give us the three most talented LB on the field. My worry is just that 2 of the three are probably playing out of their natural position. I agree that we don’t have a perfect “predator”, but keep in mind Arz used a DE Bertand Berry (6-3 260) at that spot. I think Hali, Babin, and Vrabel are all as good, if not better options then Berry. I agree that next to MLB the strong side DE is probably the biggest hole (why I’m pissed we didn’t get either Canty or Igor). I know on paper Hali and Turk are about the same size, but Tamba just doesn’t seem like a good fit at all for that position if truly does line up like a 3-4 DE. At least Turk has some experience playing inside.
Ten sacks in a season! For crying out loud that's what I used to average per game using DT in Tecmo Bowl!
Vrabel and Johnson should be in their natural positions
Curry would be Will because of Chiefs needs for 3-4/4-Under positioning
We tried Hali on Rush DE and the results were not good. If we need someone to Occupy RT and TE and not worry about any pressure there, Hali could be strong side DE. With a little Buffet action. Not exactly what you want out of the postion, but servicable.
The Predator is the problem. Curry doesn’t project as every-down Rush type and it seems that everyone that is wanting to draft him sees him as ILB, therfore Will with Vrabel at Mike. Maybe they need to be reversed. I’m still waiting for Texas Chief to weigh in but I studied a little today. Dorsey could work as weakside DE and Tyler as Nose but we need somebody Strong and Stout to stuff the strong-side DE. Maybe Moore,Egboh, or Shaughnessy in 4-5 round or Kruger in 3rd with a Center of Caldwell or Shipley in 4-5th Rds
by Steve_Chiefs on Mar 15, 2009 12:20 AM CDT up reply actions
If Pioli manages to trade down
I’ll be impressed.
This was a badass post. Hope to see it happen. Rec’d.
Vae Victis!
I like Orapko
especially since we are going to the 3-4. Maybe not at #3, but if we could trade…I know the trade talks and what ifs get old, with Cleveland dropping down to #5 and picking up their 2nd rounder, then Orakpo would be my target at #5 with LB or OL help with the 2nd round pick.
how about this?
since we have so many guys at new positions why dont we keep mixing up positions every play? like change the predator from hali to vrabel every, or switch up the mike and sams, whoever they are?
he's not Rey Lewis
he’s Aaron Curry. He is a top notch prospect, but you do not pick a LB with a top 3 pick.
I think Curry would be a very good Mike...
but i still would like us to trade down and get extra picks. A number 3 is usually worth a 1st , 2nd and 3rd by the scoring scale.
Nice post
"I can only imagine what it is going to be like in that town if we are fortunate to build a winner. You win there, you can sense that it would be something really special." - Todd Haley
Raji
What about trading down and then looking for Raji. He is the only natural NT available in the draft and could solve a lot of problems in the middle. The draft is littered with linebackers that would be an upgrade for us.
I really like Raji too
but I still think our biggest holes in this system are MLB and DE. Like Curry, he would be an upgrade over who we have but it still leaves some pretty big holes elsewhere.
Ten sacks in a season! For crying out loud that's what I used to average per game using DT in Tecmo Bowl!
He might be the only declared NT Peria Also
But there are guys that could Play Nose in draft. Hood, Moala, Brace in 2nd or 3rd
Mcgee, Taylor, Miller, And Moore in 5th
by Steve_Chiefs on Mar 15, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Donnie Edwards
Per NFL.com
I see why we released Donnie now..he ballooned and wanted Tanks position!:)
Edwards, Donnie DT Released 6-3 315 8th Season KC TBD
Curry = thumper
He can play that middle position. He’s much more physical than DJ, for example, and not just a pure pass rusher like a lot of high-rated LB prospects. He’s not a typical OLB who is a pure pass rusher like DT was, and he’s also not a typical smaller MLB who makes lots of tackles but would get eaten up trying to rush the passer. Curry’s got the skills to make plays as a pass rusher, in pass coverage, and against the run. He strong enough to handle some guards and still fast enough to blow by lots of blockers.
I love Curry but wasn’t that big on taking him at #3 overall, but learning more about the system we’re moving to, I am more encouraged, not less. I think we could go with Hali as the Predator, Curry as the MLB, Vrabel as Sam and DJ as Will.
I still would love to trade down, but it’s hard to do from #3 and our new system actually fits our personnel with Curry more than a traditional 3-4 would.
by Offense of the 70s on Mar 16, 2009 11:26 AM CDT reply actions
Good post
I’d shift Hali over to LDE and Babin to Predator, draft Curry to play sam, Vrabel at mike backer, and DJ at wilie. This takes Tank out of the starting lineup and leaves Demarrio on the bench even though I like both players, but I think it puts our best options on the field. Hali makes a good LDE but proved woefully incapable as the primary pass rusher. I think Tank is a good backup for both DEs and Demarrio can back up most LBs. So not only would we have our best players on the field, we would have a measure of depth. Also, having Babin play the predator allows us to shift to a true 3-4 defense without any personnel substitutions, making our defensive alignments difficult to anticipate.
Dorsey w/ Tyler at NT and or DT and/or Boone?
McBride? at DE? DJ was strong side last year before experiment.
Curry at Will and Johnson at Sam. Curry to OLB in 4-3 sets? Vrabel at Mike w/Beisel at backup?
Correct me if Im wrong...but
cant Vrabel play DE. if he can then i think that if we draft Curry in the first and get a middle linebacker that can play, Vrabel can be predator, curry and ? in the middle and DJ at will. that would look awsome depending on the “?”….oh and please let us not for get that Darrel Johnson looks like he could develop into a predator type player
BLAK-out!!!!!
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