Who is the Best All-Time First Round Pick by the Chiefs?
by Chris Thorman on Mar 11, 2009 12:21 PM CDT
in 2009 Kansas City Chiefs Draft
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Sorry, Sly Mo. You're not on this list.
Earlier today, I'm checking out our local Giants contingent at Big Blue View today when I came across a pretty cool series that ETVal is doing over there. The Giants fans there are going round by round in the history of the Giants' drafts and picking out the best and worst players from each round.
I thought this was a heck of an off season post idea and I want to start it today with the best of the first round by the Chiefs. The idea behind this discussion idea is to pick the not the most talented overall NFL player (if that player left the Chiefs to play for another team) but pick the best first round pick by the Chiefs, for the Chiefs. There is plenty of room for debate here so have at it.
You can check out the full list of Chiefs first round picks here. I've chosen the seven best first rounders IMO to put in the poll. They're after the jump.
All of the accolades are copied from the players' respective Wikipedia pages.
RB Abner Haynes (1960, #1 overall in AFL draft)
- 4x AFL All-Star selection (1960, 1961, 1962, 1963)
- 3x TSN All-AFL selection (1960, 1961, 1962)
- 4x All-Pro selection (1960, 1961, 1962, 1964)
- 1960 AFL Rookie of the Year
- 1960 AP AFL MVP
- 1960 UPI AFL MVP
- All-Time All-AFL 2nd Team
DT Buck Buchanan (1963, #1 overall in AFL draft)
- 6x AFL All-Star selection
- 2x Pro Bowl selection
- 6x All-AFL selection
- 2x All-Pro selection
- AFL Champion 1966, 1969
- World Champion 1969
- AFL All-Time Second Team
- Kansas City Chiefs #86 retired
via www.ogpaper.com
DT Bill Maas (1984, #5 overall)
- 2x Pro Bowl selection (1986, 1987)
- 2x All-Pro selection (1986, 1987)
- 1984 NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year
DE Neil Smith (1988, #2 overall)
- 6x Pro Bowl selection
- First-Team All-Pro selection (1993)
- 2x Second-Team All-Pro selection (1995, 1997)
- 2x Super Bowl Champion (XXXII, XXXIII)
- NFL 1990s All-Decade Team
LB Derrick Thomas (1989, #4 overall)
- 9x Pro Bowl selection (1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997)
- 3x First-team All-Pro selection (1990, 1991, 1992)
- 3x Second-team All-Pro selection (1993, 1994, 1996)
- 7x First-team All-AFC (1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1996)
- 1x Second-team All-AFC (1995)
- NFL 1990s All-Decade Team
- 1989 NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year
- 1989 UPI AFL-AFC Rookie of the Year
- 1988 Dick Butkus Award
- 1993 Walter Payton Man of the Year Award winner
CB Dale Carter (1992, #20 overall)
- 4x Pro Bowl selection (1994, 1995, 1996, 1997)
- 2x Second-Team All-Pro selection (1995, 1996)
- 1992 NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year
TE Tony Gonzalez (1997, #13 overall)
- 10x Pro Bowl selection (1999-2008)
- 6x First-Team All-Pro selection (1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2008)
- 3x Second-Team All-Pro selection (2004, 2006, 2007)
- Led NFL with 102 receptions in 2004
I have to take Derrick Thomas with Tony Gonzalez coming in a close second. Buck Buchanan would probably come in third for me.
Who do you think is the best, all-time first round pick by the Chiefs?
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I voted DT
but Gonzalez is probably a very close second for me… any way you could put up the position each played for some of us younger non-native chiefs fans?
I was just under the impression that he was.
You are probably right!
Don't blame me, I voted for content of character.
by paratrooper on Mar 11, 2009 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok thanks!
That list was depressing….
Don't blame me, I voted for content of character.
by paratrooper on Mar 11, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
I <3 DT
But I went with TG on this one. TG has set the bar high for all TEs that come into the league to match.
Remember when everyone use to compare TEs to “the next Kellen Winslow (Sr) or the next Shannon Sharp”? Not anymore, TG is the the new “next”.
It doesnt hurt that I think TG will be a unanimous first ballot HoF.
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
Agree here completely....many good points, but
…………“a unanimous first ballot Hall of Fame” says it all……and he’ll probably play for a couple more years.
Now don't get me wrong, I LOVE Derrick Thomas
(CT Chief Fan just beat me to my point)
DT was fantastic, but he was not the best ever to play the game at his position…Tony is.
Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.
I think you need two polls
one defensive one offensive.
That way we can vote for DT and TG.
Blame my wife!
Waiting until August!
Can't really do two polls
But good idea for the future.
by Chris Thorman on Mar 11, 2009 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
#1
Yeah its really trying to determine who THE best #1 was. If it was a favorite poll I could see 2 polls. :)
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
is it bad if
in the 902 I had a Greg Hill jersey next to my Steve Bono one in the closet?
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 12:41 PM CDT up reply actions
that's supposed to read well, he was the "real deal" =)
Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
Harry S. Truman
you have no idea
how hard in 95-96 it was to find ANY KC jersey in eastern PA. I took what I could find
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah he didn't make it
Maybe on the “other” first round list.
by Chris Thorman on Mar 11, 2009 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions
that
will be a fun poll!
Arguing who is the worst pick should be like comedy gold.
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I cant even choose i love them all and not in a sexual way
FOUR F'S FIND UM FEEL UM FUGUM FORGET UM.
Tony G
will retire as the best to ever play his position and he was taken with the 12th pick. I love DT but he wasn’t the best OLB to ever play and he was taken with the 4th overall pick so the expectations were a little higher for him.
Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
Harry S. Truman
13th
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Probably a smart move
=)
Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.
Tony didn't have to compete with the same level
of athletes to be “best ever” at his position. LB’s are far more athletic and there are a lot more of them and yet DT is still considered among the best ever. Also, expectations for a tight end taken at 12 are pretty damn high; he wasn’t exactly a surprise.
the point is
he is the only draft pick in the history of the chiefs to be considered the best to ever play that postion. i love dt too but tg will be a first ballot hall of famer and it seems to me the people who cover the tight end the most are linebackers so i don’t know if i buy the more athletic argument
Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
Harry S. Truman
+1
Comparing positions is apples to oranges. The fact remains that when you think of THE best TE in the league in history, i would venture most think Tony.
DT was a GREAT LB (and now a Hof LB) but he is the not the BEST LB that most people would think of when asked that question.
So when we are asked “who is KC’s BEST #1 pick ever?” Its gotta be TG.
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I understand the point.
But I disagree. How much has the use of the LB changed in over the history of the NFL? Now, compare it to how much the use of the TE has changed over that history. You can say that Tony is the greatest TE ever, and not many will argue with you, but it simply doesn’t mean as much to me as being one of the greatest LB’s because of the fact that the history of the LB is so much longer than the tight end as it is used today.
but you said it yourself
One of the greatest, not THE greatest.
Yes since the 80’s TEs are no longer blocking first oriented, but I just can’t accept as an argument that because the position has changed it cheapens his accomplishments.
Again I understand where you are coming from, but there was a reason why it took DT so long to get into the Hall (other than Gretz being his presenter).
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions
ONE of the greatest LB's
is more impressive, to me, than THE greatest TE. Basically, like you said, the position has changed since the 80’s. So TG is the best since the 80’s, not in the history of the NFL. DT is one of the greatest from a group of players whose history started at the beginning of professional football.
1) The linebacker position has changed too
2) Tony can also block pretty damn well
3) Derrick Thomas was not a conventional linebacker, so that comparison is difficult
Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.
I just think
Its like the Ray Guy argument. People say he was the greatest Punter in NFL History (note: at a position that has not changed in scheme as far as I can tell) yet they can’t vote the guy into the hall because he was a punter and not a QB/LB etc etc. Certain positions are valued higher than others, and in the grand scheme of say would I rather have a Star LB or a star TE, i’d always go LB.
When determining the best #1 pick KC has ever had you have to go with standing, Tony is the best pick because he is regarded as the best at his position.
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions
+1
But if DT was still here he would be the greastest.
Len Dawson:
"Lamar Hunt had a dream and, the thing is, we had dreams, too. Just imagine the number of people that he has touched because he said, 'I'm going after this dream."'
by smokin iowa chief on Mar 11, 2009 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Dead On
Derrick Thomas played a sexier position, and he played it well. But he was no LT. Tony G on the other hand, changed the game. People draft different because of Tony G. The whole position is different. I remember when Tony started lining up in the slot and it was a new thing for a TE to line up in the slot. He changed the game. And because of that, he is probably the greatest Chief 1st round pick ever.
Beat the Donkeys!!
:)
No prob
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
Buck is the only one on the list
who made it to the Super Bowl with the Chiefs…and actually won.
Its gotta be Buck. As much as DT could dominate a game, Buck did it better and did it in the middle of the field.
The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.
Amen brother.
He went to two and won one, and he was HUGE in them getting to both.
Facts are stubborn things, but statistics are more pliable. Mark Twain
" Buck is the only one on the list ! "
Unfortunately for the younger non-native Chiefs fans like Pontiaclvr ; were not born when he " dominated a game ,.._com" ! May he rest in peace ! A true Hall Of Famer ! If you have a highlight reel of Mr.Buck B. I am sure we would appreciate Mr.Buck B.’s highlights !
by 65tosspowertrap on Mar 11, 2009 2:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Uhh...
Could you please add Ryan Simms to that list? He’s got my vote.
interesting note on Trezelle
from wikipedia:
In 2000, Jenkins was drafted 156th overall by the San Francisco Demons of the XFL but failed to make the team.
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
hmm..
I like your thinking and that is a strong pick but im sticking with big Ry.
The worst list will come tomorrow morning
by Chris Thorman on Mar 11, 2009 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Already salivating at the thought
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
by CT Chief Fan on Mar 11, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Gotta give it to Tony
He is the best player at his position ever – hands down. The dude owns just about every TE record there is.
"I can only imagine what it is going to be like in that town if we are fortunate to build a winner. You win there, you can sense that it would be something really special." - Todd Haley
It's got to be TG
I loved DT, but you have to say that this was by far the best move that CP ever made …. trading up from #18 to #13 to snag Gonzalez. What an unbelievable payoff. And with the #18 pick, the Oilers select …….. DE Kenny Holmes. Wow.
The Chiefs obtained the Oilers first-round pick (13th overall – used on Gonzalez) and their fourth-round pick (110th overall – used on QB Pat Barnes) in exchange for Kansas City’s original first-round selection (18th overall – used on DE Kenny Holmes), a third-round pick (81st overall – used on T Scott Sanderson), a fourth-round pick (116th overall – subsequently traded by Houston to New Orleans) and a sixth-round selection (181st overall – used on LB Dennis Stallings).
Funny
how Carl Peterson drafted both DT & TG. I think thats more a testament to him being eternal than him being a good evaluator of talent though
by KansasCityShuffle on Mar 11, 2009 1:19 PM CDT reply actions
I also find it funny that in his last year as GM
he made one last fantastic move, and traded up to get Branden Albert…
Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.
Carl was a good GM
It’s vogue to blast him right now because of how he went out and how he stuck around for 20 years, but there were a lot of good moves made in those 20 years. It’s just that none of them added up to a championship.
We never liked his pseudo-california style, but you gotta look at the whole picture and say that overall he did a good job, he just got to ride out the credit of his early success about four years too long.
by Official Arrowhead Pride Parade on Mar 11, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Even a broken clock
is right twice a day
by KansasCityShuffle on Mar 11, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Nice
I like that one
"I can only imagine what it is going to be like in that town if we are fortunate to build a winner. You win there, you can sense that it would be something really special." - Todd Haley
Gale Sayers
He was without a doubt our best first round pick. Too bad he never actually played for the Chiefs.
Interesting results so far
I think I could almost predict the birth years of those who have voted or come very close to it
"But what do I know, I'm AP's new assclown and I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"
I can predict one thing
all those who have voted are younger than Ol’ Fart Lanier
=)
Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.
I voted for Buck
eventhough I was born in 82 and grew up playing pop warner with #58 on my jersey. Fortunately, I’ve been lucky enough to also see some of those classic games and realize that Buck may have been the best LB ever, a testament to how dominant he was.
How do I say this without insulting you...
………………………………………………………………………………
…………………………………………………….
Buck was a DT :)
"But what do I know, I'm AP's new assclown and I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"
Went with Tony G.
(here come the flames) DT was a terror on the field, but playing opposite Neil Smith helped his performance, and DT wasn’t /quite/ the same after they let Smith go. He’s in the HOF, and deservedly so, but…
Tony’s played at a high level consistently, with a broad mix of talent around him, and in a number of different schemes. The changes to the O haven’t mattered, Tony’s always made an impact. That, and as noted above, TG’s become the prototype for the receiving TE in today’s game.
Cassel vs. Thigpen in Camp should improve the play of both.
Next on the need list: linebacker, and both lines
by Bleedingredandgold on Mar 11, 2009 1:59 PM CDT reply actions
Defense first!
How many times must it occure for the public to understand that defense wins championships, period….Therefor either Buck or Derick has to be a more important pick to the Chiefs chances of going there. Since they went twice with Buck, and won in SBIV, I give him the nod as the best 1st rounder ever for the club. Period. TP
i dont disagree with that
But the poll is not about importance, because I surely would NOT say TG’s importance is greater than any other KC Hall of Famer.
The poll is about the best pick and I think picking any person who is lauded at the best at his position, regardless of what that position is, is an automatic winner.
Maybe im taking the poll for too much at face value, but thats what I think.
"I will fight you!"
"What is your weapon?"
"My bare hands!"
"That is stupid. I will use a sword and I will cut off your bare hands."
I thought the point was to select the best draft pick not best player
It was a given that DT and Tony G were going to be stars in the NFL when drafted. Dale Carter was taken 20 overall as a CB/Safety. Guy was a real good punt returner and great corner. I think anytime you grab and all pro with the 20th pick, that is impressive. I agree there are better players on the list, but I felt the Dale Carter draft pick was the most impressive.
Tough choice
I picked Gonzalez because he IS the best tight end to play the game so far. Off point where was Bobby Bell drafted?
I picked DT, but Dale Carter is an interesting case
I had an interesting discussion about Carter with a Vikings fan back in November. He was arguing that Carter was one of the best corners he had ever seen. He was an older man who loved to wax poetically about the days when Minnesota were the Buffalo Bills, the second best always. I was too young (9-13) to fully analyze the defensive players when Carter played, but I agreed that he was a significant contributor for the Chiefs. The Chiefs with Lewis, Carter, and Hasty had three incredibly gifted corners in the 90’s which helped when DT and Neil couldn’t get the rush on, as rare as that was. I sometimes wonder what he could have been, if he hadn’t had the substance abuse problems. His career never recovered after his suspension.
On my vote, DT changed the Kansas City Chiefs, and made them relevant again. Not single-handed, but he was the most important cog in their success. Tony is the only Chief who will be considered best ever, but in terms of a successful draft pick, DT had far more effect on the performance of the Chiefs. Though I may have to contradict myself, and say that the Chiefs were allowed to have a dominant offense without drafting a #1 WR because of TG. I’m too young to have seen Buck, but I wouldn’t disagree with anyone picking him.
"Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue."
Would have actually gone for Neil Smith
But Then I think about him Playing for the Broncos and Chargers…Thst’s a bad aftertaste that I just can’t quite get rid of…
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