3-4 Defense a No-No for Chiefs

by KU2010 on Mar 10, 2009 10:19 AM CDT Comment 20 comments

The 3-4 defense is chic again in the NFL; it's all the rage. The Packers and Broncos both are reportedly switching to the 3-4 this offseason. The majority of the best defenses right now are running the 3-4: Pittsburgh, Baltimore, New England, San Diego.

So why not join them? Well, it's not that simple; you have to have the proper personnel to change.

On the surface, It seems really easy—just subtract a down lineman and add a linebacker, right?

Wrong. The size of almost everyone on the front seven has to be bigger. The DTs that generally weigh around 300 lbs. in a 4-3 now have to weigh closer to 330 because they now have to take on two linemen. The DEs now have to weigh upwards of 300 lbs.

Even the LBs have to be bigger and stronger, because they now have to take on more offensive linemen.

Just as a reference:

Dallas DEs:
Chris Canty - 6'7, 305
Marcus Spears - 6'4 305

Pittsburgh DEs:
Aaron Smith - 6'5 300
Brett Keisel - 6'5 285

New England DEs:
Richard Seymour - 6'6 310
Ty Warren - 6'5 300

Glenn Dorsey - 6'1 300

Doesn't really fit, huh?

Don't get me wrong, though, if the Chiefs switched to a 3-4 tomorrow, Dorsey would have to play DE, and would do OK. But the Chiefs are paying him $51 million to get in the backfield and be a one-gap, disruptive force, not a two-gap run-stuffer that simply takes on blockers. That's just not the kind of player he is.

Dorsey finding a spot to play is only half of the problem; finding LBs to play in the system is the other. As is, the Chiefs have exactly one starting LB worthy in the 3-4. Derrick Johnson could move inside and play one of the ILB spots.

The other three spots would have to be filled. Finding the other ILB would not be too hard, most LBs can play in that spot. It's finding the guys who can play on the outside that is really hard.

The OLBs in a 3-4 have to be big (6'2+), strong (260+ lbs.), and fast. Shawne Merriman is a perfect example—he is 6'4, 270 lbs. People who are 260 lbs. and super-athletic are just a rare breed. They are few and far between, like true NTs. The Chiefs have none of these guys on the roster and would have to work hard to find some suitable before the season started.

The best, and smartest, thing for the Chiefs to do is take it slow and acquire 3-4 talent when they can. Do what the Cardinals did this past year and mix in a few 3-4 looks during a game. Be deliberate and make the switch when it is best for the football team.

Poll

Do you think we should switch to the 3-4?

Yes

39 votes

No

59 votes

I'll do whatever Pioli wants

50 votes

148 votes | Poll has closed

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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Comments

like it or not it’s happening so we just gotta sit back and have faith in Pioli and the coaching staff.

by JrGrayson on Mar 10, 2009 10:30 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't think the switch has been confirmed by Haley or Pioli

Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.

by PVChiefsfan on Mar 10, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I thought Pioli said something along the lines of

were bringing in Vrabel to be a leader who is familiar with the sytem.

considering Vrabel has played for Pittsburgh and New England… He only kind of knows one system. Could that count as a confirmation??

Time is a great teacher... unfortunately it kills all it's pupils.

by 808NaNz808 on Mar 10, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

But the Chiefs are paying him $51 million to get in the backfield and be a one-gap, disruptive force, not a two-gap run-stuffer that simply takes on blockers.

Isn’t that basically what Dorsey did last year? Run stuffing/taking on blockers? He led all rookie DT’s in tackles I believe.

by Vince D on Mar 10, 2009 10:31 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

no its not

Dorsey was never a 2 gap player from teh DT spot last year.

The Powers Of Astute Observation Are Often Mistaken As Cynacism By Those That Do Not Posses Them -- G.B. Shaw

by Texas Chief on Mar 10, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, he was

remember the Whitlock article about how we were misusing him? He shouldn’t have been 2-tech, 2-gap guy, but we were using him that way (I suspect because our LB’s were so horrible)

Marley will be walking soon...she could probably play Linebacker better than some of the guys we had.

by PVChiefsfan on Mar 10, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

they lined him straight up on the guard, yes

But he did not have a 2 gap responsibility.
He played a 2 technique, but had responsibility for just 1 gap.
He didn’t have to choose each play weather to play the A or the B gap. He knew by the call of the Defense which gap was his, and which gap the LB was responcible for.

At least that’s what I saw from watching the games. Obviously I cannot tell you what Gunthar was calling in from the sideline, but that’s how I read it.

The Powers Of Astute Observation Are Often Mistaken As Cynacism By Those That Do Not Posses Them -- G.B. Shaw

by Texas Chief on Mar 10, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'll do some additional research on this.

The Powers Of Astute Observation Are Often Mistaken As Cynacism By Those That Do Not Posses Them -- G.B. Shaw

by Texas Chief on Mar 10, 2009 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I see what you're saying

I think people assume though if you line up straight across from the guard, you are responsible for the tackle-guard gap and the guard-center gap. Whether that was what Gun told him to do or not I have no idea, but the DE was rushing from the outside so someone has to be in charge of that gap and I assume its Dorsey.

by Vince D on Mar 10, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wrong

Sorry, but Dorsey often lined up straight over the guard.

In fact, it was probably his most common positioning. It’s not the way I would ever play him in a 4-3, but its what they did.

DAMN PV, beat me to it.

by kcsno56 on Mar 10, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

They were using him wrong last year too.

Yes he was frequently lined up heads-up on the guard. This obviously was a misuse of him, and he struggled last year. The fact that he led all rooked DT’s in tackles is a testament to how great he actually is.

If we ever want him to get to that “Baby-Sapp” player that we drafted him to be, he cannot be used in this way. He has to be allowed to shoot the gap in a one-gap scheme.

by KU2010 on Mar 10, 2009 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I am okay with a gradual switch but...

I do not think the Chiefs have the players to man a full out switch to the 3/4. If they play the 4-3 as a base defense and bring in different personnel on 3rd down to get extra pressure or throw the offense off in a 3-4, I think that could be very effective.
In fact, I am pretty sure that is what we will see this coming season. I think a hybrid defense could be very effective in the NFL. That is essentially what Pendergast did last year in Arizona. It seems to have worked out pretty well for them. And I dont want to hear about their defensive stats because I don’t care. They got to the Super Bowl and their defense did a great job in the playoffs.

by Chiefsfan1970 on Mar 10, 2009 11:13 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree

I think if we were going to switch to a 3-4 permanently, we would have pursued Igor Olshansky or Chris Canty. Pioli knows how important the DL is in a 3-4, and this is showed in that all of the Patriots DL were first round picks.

If they are expecting to switch this year look for us to look at Raji in the first round, and Jarron Gilbert in the 3rd round. Those two along with Alphonso Boone would be a pretty decent DL.

I would look for us to do what Arizona did last year and throw in a few 3-4 sets per game this year.

by KU2010 on Mar 10, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs