Cassel VS. Thigpen
by J ray on Dec 3, 2009 3:02 PM CST
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PrintTo get this article started I would like to make it abundantly clear that at the end of last season I was for continuing the rebuild of the o-line and defense and drafting a QB in 2010. Over the past thirty years I have watched many a promising QB fail behind a weak o-line on a team with a bad defense. After both QB'S have played 10 games in similar conditions here are their stats.
CASSEL: 13 TD'S,7 PICS,35 SACKS (averages 6 yard loss per sack),1898 YDS PASSING,147 RUSHING,55.6 PERCENT COMPLETIONS,78 QB RATING
THIGPEN: 22TD'S(includes 3 rushing,1 recieving),12 PICS,26 SACKS(only 140 yards lost) 2,680 YDS PASSING,396 RUSHING 54.8 PERCENT COMPLETIONS,85 QB RATING.
(Could not get a stat on batted balls but those of us that watched both QB'S in all 10 games know that Cassel's is much higher.)
The bottom line is that Thigpen is 4 years younger and out produced Cassel behind a worse o-line (yes,O'Callaghan and Ndukwe are better than SACKintosh and Jones). Cassel has a much better wide recieving core and now that Charles is the featured back a better run game. The only thing Thigpen had that Cassel doesn't was Tony G. and guts. One of these QB's was $750,000 a year the other cost a 2nd round pick and 63 million dollars wich makes him one of the highest payed players in the NFL,can you guess wich one?
Its blatently obvious to anyone whose not gulping down the Kool-aid the reasons Cassel didn't start at any level no arm,no pocket presence and he just doesn't posess the ability to make the proper quick desicions under fire. Cassel is 28 years old by the time the Chiefs are ready to compete he'll be in his thirties if hes still playing,Tyler was 24 the perfect age for a rebuilding team.
Also look at the draft this year Colt Mcoy the ncaa (ALL-TIME) completion percentage leader and leading rusher for 2 seasons on one of the best teams in the country,Sam Bradford ,and Max Hall just to name a few .Yes its like a friend of mine said Cassel will be alright if we get an o-line. I replied yeah and thats all he will ever be just alright but ok or alright NEVER WINS TITLES!
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.
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There is no "only" when it comes to Tony G
New mixtape out from Symbol Heavy. Check out it
by HIV 2 Elway on Dec 3, 2009 3:10 PM CST reply actions 5 recs
just threw up in my mouth a little
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
by stagdsp on Dec 3, 2009 3:13 PM CST reply actions 8 recs
What you left out....
Thigpen – 2008 Stats – 18 passing TD’s against 12 interceptions in 11 starts. The Chiefs ultimately went 1-10 on their way to a 2-14 record with him at QB
Thigpen now is 3rd string for the Dolphins. He will never be a pocket passer and he won one game. It is not apples to apples to compare last year to this year. Too much has changed. Who was Thigpens number one receiver…Pro Bowl and HOF player Tony Gonzalez with 1,058 yards and 10 touchdowns. Cassel is 3-7 in a system overhaul that started the week before the season started. We have plugged in more players than a house at Christmas time. Cassel has two more “W’s” than Thigpen and engineered two 4th quarter wins. Don’t tell me Cassel’s statistical performance wouldn’t be very different with Gonzalez.
The Chiefs have experienced the most change in the NFL over the last year. Such an instant gratification society, give it time. Don’t get me wrong, I think that Cassell has considerable room for improvement but I think we have resolved our QB position if he can continue to show improvement.
by casselreadychiefs on Dec 3, 2009 3:35 PM CST reply actions 10 recs
fantastic comment, wreck!
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Agree and I would add
that Cassel would no doubt agree with you: he has considerable room for improvement. Rookie or veteran, every topflight player continually strives to improve. This season isn’t easy for anyone, least of all the team. They’re all competitors and want to be the best. But this team is making progress. I can see it.
what you left out
The Chiefs defense in 2008 was historicaly bad. If our defense were that poor this year we would definatley be 0 and 11. Its just not possible to win with a defense that is that bad.Thiggy threw for 2,680 yards only about 700 to tony the rest to players that were special teams players and yes Dwayne Bowe too.
Cassel doesn't look like he's a pocket passer either
He had one last week and couldn’t step up into it. He also is really reminiscent of crumbly old “Huard the Fetal.”
OH........
…………….I am definatly ok with you including Cassel’s stats from his 11th start as Chief vs.Denver. and his 14.6 QB rating
While we are beating a dead horse...
Grbac was soooo much better than Gannon and Huard should have started over Trent the whole time!!!
by chiefsandcigars on Dec 3, 2009 3:35 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
Jesus...its like debating with Al Gore!
by chiefsandcigars on Dec 3, 2009 3:36 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Well this is the interwebz he inventoredz
or whatever
This is my signature line. It is full of awesome and win.
by KCSatchmo on Dec 3, 2009 3:40 PM CST up reply actions
I'll be so happy
when we can start debating who sucks less instead of who sucks more.
This is my signature line. It is full of awesome and win.
by KCSatchmo on Dec 3, 2009 3:41 PM CST up reply actions
And Livingston was WAY better than Dawson
No way KC gets to the SB if Livingston doesn’t play most of the season.
And Fuller was coming along, no reason to bench him for Kenney.
Of course it all started with trading Cotton Davidson to get the first pick and take some nobody named Buck Buchanan.
-"A man may be a fool and not know it, but not if he is married." - H.L. Mencken
Amen
"Football isn't a contact sport, it's a collision sport. Dancing is a contact sport."
--Duffy Daugherty
"Some people think football is a matter of life and death. I assure you, it's much more serious than that."
--Bill Shankly
by Chiefs_10_TG on Dec 4, 2009 11:06 AM CST up reply actions
minus 1 billion for sarcasm font fail
This space for rent.
by averagegatsby on Dec 3, 2009 7:25 PM CST up reply actions
isnt the blockquote the sarcasm font?
its working on my display
by chiefsandcigars on Dec 3, 2009 8:21 PM CST up reply actions
nope...
this is blockquote
this is sarcasm font
to get sarcasm font you have to type the word code in between < >
This space for rent.
by averagegatsby on Dec 3, 2009 8:47 PM CST up reply actions
thanks
thats not in the formatting guide
by chiefsandcigars on Dec 4, 2009 11:55 AM CST up reply actions
Who Said Al Gore didn't he invent the internet.
Seriously this post is like meditating while taking a big stinky poo.
You asked for it!
Yeah, let's just keep matriculatin' the ball down the field, boys! ...
by oldchiefsfan on Dec 3, 2009 3:49 PM CST reply actions 4 recs
Ive got to agree
Chiefs should have kept Thiggy, drafted Maualuga in the 2nd. Im not sold on Cassell…
I'd rather die on my feet than be living on my knees
I love that picture....
Says it all, seriously…
Don't forget to be an AP-vangelist...Tell A Friend...
funny......
If I remeber right this clip is from thiggys first start ever in the nfl. so what
I don't use it often...
But yea…this is beating the dead horse…A guy that isn’t on the team anymore, seriously.
Don't forget to be an AP-vangelist...Tell A Friend...
HORSE VS CAR!!!!!!!!!!!!
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes; after that, who cares?! He's a mile away and you've got his shoes!
Thiggy's numbers were skewed
I like Tyler, I think he is a gamer. But how many completions last year were jump-balls to Tony G? Anybody can complete a jump ball to Tony. Gonzales wanted Thiggy to be the starter ’cause he fed it to him so much. Thigpen would fare much worse than Cassel if inserted into the same situation.
Oh man what a rip off...
I thought this was celebrity death match. I wanted to watch them fight. Now what?
by krayfish on Dec 3, 2009 4:44 PM CST reply actions 3 recs
LOL - You're killing me Kray!
-"A man may be a fool and not know it, but not if he is married." - H.L. Mencken
Also Cassel was a 3rd string QB at USC behind Carson Palmer and Matt Lienart....
….ever heard of those guys? Yeah they did alright in college. Where did Thiggy play college ball? Oh that’s right COASTAL CAROLINA! Your telling me that Cassel couldn’t cut it at Coastal Carolina? Really? Cassel played for USC for Christ’s sake! Most of thier 3rd stringers would be starters for the majority of NCAA fotball teams! Get a hold of yourself.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
no ... Cassel SAT ON THE BENCH at USC ...
Universtiy of Spoiled Children … Leinart? oh yeah … he sucks, just ask anyone in Arizona … and oh yeah, Cassel was BEHIND Leinart and … oh yeah, Leinart SUCKS
end of discussion
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
Is this sarcasm? Leinart and Palmer both won the Heisman in college…
If someone asks you if you want extra mayonnaise you have to say yes, cus that's part of it.
-Jared Allen
by JComp11 on Dec 4, 2009 9:02 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
no, it's NOT sarcasm
the subject matter is Cassel, not Leinart or Palmer
so, go find his career stats and report back to us how incredibly awesome he was
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
Leinart sucks?
You want to say that Leinart sucks but the dude was hands down the best QB in college for like 3 years and I do recall a Heisman and a NC or 2 (I know one was an AP NC).
Per Wikipedia:
Career:
Leinart finished his college career with 807 completions on 1,245 attempts (64.8% completion percentage) for 10,693 yards and 99 touchdowns with just 23 interceptions. He is USC’s all-time leader in career touchdown passes and completion percentage, and is second at USC behind Palmer in completions and yardage. He averaged nearly 8.6 yards per attempt, and averaged only one interception every 54 attempts. He was 37–2 as a starter.
Stats:
2003: 255/402 (63.4%) for 3556 yards and 38 TD vs. 9 INT. 32 carries for -62 yards and 0 TD.
2004: 269/412 (65.3%) for 3322 yards and 33 TD vs. 6 INT. 49 carries for -44 yards and 3 TD.
2005: 283/431 (65.7%) for 3815 yards and 28 TD vs. 8 INT. 51 carries for 36 yards and 6 TD.
So yeah I guess he sucked in college right? Give me a break, Cassel never saw the field because of the great talent in front of him. I never said he was “awesome” I was simply saying he played for a program with much more talent to compete with.
I don’t kow how you can say it’s not about Leinart and Palmer when they are the sole reason that Matt didn’t play.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Now as for Cassel....
….Because of the above player he hardly played in college. What I can tell you is that Matt was a pretty highly touted QB coming out of highschool. He was a top 10 QB as well as a top 100 player in the nation. So you could say he was probably a decent player. Unfortunatly there is not enough statistical data to compare the two players. On a crap team like the Chiefs have been the last few years, Matt has 2 more wins as a starter and that is with a team without TG and undergoing a massive transformation. Thigpen played in a scheme that played to his strengths and took some teams by surprise…. and he won 1 game. It would have been just a matter of time before the NFL caught on to how to stop it.
Now don’t get me wrong, I rooted for Thiggy every week and I wanted him to succeed as much as the next guy. The bottom line is that I don’t think Thigpen has the tools to play QB in the NFL at the same level that Cassel’s tools allow him to play at. But when the argument is that Matt never started in college, and that makes him a worse player than Thigpen, I have to argue that there were reasons that he didn’t play. I felt that J ray was being unfair to Cassel’s accomplishments.
My original post was written in a little bit of a nasty tone and for that I appologize. It’s someone’s opinion and I usually try not to judge so harshly.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Surely not THAT..............
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes; after that, who cares?! He's a mile away and you've got his shoes!
man
those were a couple of very entertaining days
Holy Shit!!!...Peterson resigned...Am I dead?...Is This Heaven?
by RoyalsFanStuckInCardsLand on Dec 3, 2009 8:07 PM CST up reply actions
He makes some valid points...
obviously it doesn’t matter since we gave cassel a 60 mil contract and Bones is elsewhere…
The only thing I think really needs to be reevaluated is that Tony G would have made a HUGE difference this year, or any year for matter. I’d be willing to bet he was the sole reason for the difference in stats… Maybe we’ve forgotten just how good that dude was.
I think its more of a Gailey vs Haley thing than a Cassel vs Thigpen thing
Gailey + Arrowspread = Exciting til the end
Haley + Johnson = Asleep before half time
Haley – Johnson + Charles = Big play excitement
Haley + Time = A better franchise (At least it better)
by Bono Bootleg on Dec 4, 2009 8:30 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
All this post shows
Is that neither one of them are NFL first tier QBs. They both have been and should continue to be backups.
This has to be the most green Ive seen in one thread...
Now Green Me!
by tomahawk44 on Dec 4, 2009 9:39 AM CST reply actions 3 recs
Next time...
Search Cassel and Thigpen before you rehash these arguments.
I thought I had time traveled back to the offseason.
"The dirtier the sound the best I breathe, I tried to do it all for you and you didn't do anything for me"
I loved this post
Couldn’t wait to see the latest dead horse pics. Can anyone post a Chief beating on a donkey?
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