Mock with the Juice...12-28-09
Goals:
Improve the defense so what we have a young ascending potential top 5 D in a few years. To bring Arrowhead back we need a great D.
Improve the interior line play. Both depth and starters. I am pleased with O'Callaghan and think it is too early to give up on Albert.
Improve the Coaching Staff as it was assembled so late in the game. OC, QB coach, and DC.
Add SPEED to the offense, defense, and special teams.
Coaching:
Hire Charlie Weis as OC and QB Coach. This is a HUGE need for both the QB position and to help Haley focus more on game management. Shared an office with Haley with the Jets it just makes too much sense.
Hire Romeo Crennel as DC and allow him to hire his own assistants. I know these are not original hires but they are the best available coach's and have experience in both the offense and defense we run and with Pioli and Haley.
Free Agency:
Resign:
WR Chris Chambers - would be nice boost to have Bowe, Chambers, and Cassel on the same page working together for year 2. Will overpay for Chambers but Cassel needs as much support at WR next year as it is a make or break year for him.
QB Brodie Croyle - great arm and depth. Still looks like a kicker but rocket for an arm.
TE Leonard Pope - really helped this year. Good 2nd TE as Cottam looks to be the answer.
OLB Mike Vrabel - played great against the Bengals and is very key for the defense to get out of this losing culture. I will take 22 mike vrabels.
FS Jarrad Page - should come back ready to contribute.
S Mike Brown - would not hand him the job but he has value. Would be nice to draft berry and let him learn from Brown. (while Berry starts of course!)
OLB Matt Roth – Would be an upgrade at OLB and add more pass rush. Local Iowa guy that is still young.
RG Stephen Neal – NE locks up Mankins and Neal immediately upgrades the RG spot for us. If only for a year as we add depth in the draft. I don't want to just rely on a rookie center and guard.
NT Ryan Pickett – GB has Rajii and Pickett will get big payday. He is our major signing and in huge demand so we will need to overpay. We need a solid vet that can play so we do not have to risk/wait for another rookie to develop. I think with this signing the entire D Line comes together and really turns into a strength next year.
WR Kevin Walter – good possession receiver that can CATCH the ball.
OLB Darryl Tapp – young player that has some upside as a pass rusher if the Seahawks let him go.
RD 1 FS Eric Berry Tennessee – Best player available period. Suh is gone and right now i do not see Okung as being a franchise LT. McClain is tempting.
RD 2 MLB Brandon Spikes Florida – might not be here but the MLBs slid last year. GREAT talent that along with Pickett and Berry would solidify the middle for years.
RD 2 C Kris O'Dowd USC - great career at USC and will make immediate impact. If you have not seen the piece on ESPN with Jake Olson its a good watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX0ovhkgR7s
RD 3 MLB Micah Johnson Kentucky- very talented player that would add size and a physical presence to our D. I am tired of teams running the ball right at us. Best way to improve any D (or any team for that matter) is stop the run and give them 3rd and long. Best way to bring arrowhead back is to give us a physical tough defense to cheer for.
RD 4 WR Jordan Shipley Texas – as much as I want a big body WR (Alexander) we have Bowe and shipley will be a huge upgrade in the slot and on returns. This gives us Chambers, Bowe, Walter, and Shipley. Big improvement plus he is a solid return man. I think he falls to the 4th due to 40 time.
RD 5 OG Jeff Byers USC – can play center too and has injury problems but huge talent. Should be great depth on the line and could develop into a starter. Was a 5 star center out of high school that just got banged up a little.
RD 5 WR/RB/QB Juice Williams – could be the short yardage back we need and add a wildcat option to our offense. Should fly under the radar but a great talent and has a place in the NFL. Imagine what you could do with some goal line packages with Charles and Juice…and Haley is creative enough to call it. Plus i do not want to use a high pick to add a short yardage back.
RD 5 DE/OLB Jeffrey Fitzgerald KSU – huge upside and great player for KSU. kind of a tweener but like Gilberry cannot have enough players with a good motor that can get to the QB.
Ok thoughts? I know i did not draft a tackle but I am fine with O'Cal and Albert for one more year.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.
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I dont think
Shipley falls to the 4th round. Especially with the success of the smaller, slot recievers in the NFL now days. I’ve seen this guy play in person many a times and he consistantly gets behind the deepest guy, I think his 40 time will suprise you.
It's hard to see the Chiefs signing anywhere close to that number of FAs
6 of their own plus 5 from other teams – not going to happen, especially if the league goes without a cap. Pat Kirwan suggests a cap-free year would LIMIT free agency, not open it up. For instance, players will require MORE years of service before becoming free, and teams will have 3 tags rather than 1.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80864e15&template=with-video&confirm=true
So, given that it is unlikely the Chiefs will substantially improve through free agency, their only choice is through the draft. This means to me that the team can not draft two MLBs, can not wait until the 2nd day for a passrusher or a passcatcher.
I like your logic here
Especially good thought with Kevin Walter, who I feel is underrated as a WR. After some of the more recent performances of our offense, I would like to see one of the second rounders used on a passcatcher. I’d take Golden Tate with that 2a pick. Jordan Shipley should be gone by the 4th round, so I’d like to see us go NT here.
4th round NT
that’s a good idea… especially IF KC lands one of the big guys in FA.
You gotta have developmental guys behind starters in as many positions as possible.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Yes preferably Powe or Troupe
Like all your options except Neal, Goff experiance not again please.
Not a big O’Dowd fan he benefits from talent around him.
Juice Williams would rather have Armanti Edwards if we go that route.
Rd 5 don’t like any of those picks.
Could Niswanger become a guard?
I have no idea… but what I saw in Waters yesterday was a fat guy that was geting older and losing his skills. Seriously, did you see him? Back away from the mashed potatoes dude. Depending on his contract status, it wouldn’t surprise me to see Waters NOT on this team next year.
O-line, LB, WR, are our core needs. Probably in that order IMO.
We are building a fighting force of extwaordinary magnitude.
he could...
Waters hasn’t played bad at all this year, except for the penalties.
again, people are down on the OL, but they just blocked for a 100yd rusher, giving up only 1 sack against a top 5 defense… what more do you want??
KC needs to develop a replacement for Waters, for sure… but he should still have another solid year or two left.
That being said, Rudy could be a guard, and KC could get some good mileage out of Ndukwe, Alleman, Brown, Smith as well.
Center is the top priority for an upgrade on the OL, everything else is gravy, IMO
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Shipley won't fall to the fourth
But Alexander might, due to his injury history and only one year fully starting. Pioli wouldn’t draft a guy with so many games missed, but a man can only dream.
NT should be our TOP priority in free agency this year...
That is one position that could upgrade our entire defense with one dominant player in that position. Right now, Dorsey and T-Jax are both drawing double teams and our opponents are basically letting their Center handle our NT. Once we get a big widebody in there who can pull some of the doubles off of the DEs, our whole D-line is going to look waaay better. So will our LBs because all of a sudden, our blitz packages will start to work and they will start getting some sacks. Obviously, this would benefit the secondary as well due to the added pressure on opposing QBs.
A great NT will be huge in turning this defense around. It really needs to happen in Free agency though, otherwise, we will be waiting 3 years to develop our own guy if we draft him.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Dec 28, 2009 11:48 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
+1
I completely agree with this. I would love to see an experienced NT come in and get that line going in the right direction. I don’t wanna see a high draft pick used on one and then wait for them to develop. If we spend a little money this offseason, this would be a great way to do it…
by Hail2DaChiefs on Dec 28, 2009 11:53 AM CST up reply actions
Problem with that is who is for sure going to be available? I’d like to see both happen personally because all the NT available are near 30 and big boys that takes a tole, in 2 years we will probably be talking about replacing that NT we just signed. Sign a NT draft one 2-3rd round solve current problem and groom one for long term.
+1
I agree. That’s the best approach for both long term and for next year. Most of the good NTs who are still fairly young will most likely be resigned. IE: Wilfork
by Chiefsfan1970 on Dec 28, 2009 12:04 PM CST up reply actions
I had that in mind the
whole time karkz…….didn’t mention it in my response here, but on another mock I suggest we use the 4th on a NT to groom for the future…..
by Hail2DaChiefs on Dec 28, 2009 1:25 PM CST up reply actions
Berry seems to be the AP favorite
Berry is quality player and safety has been a problem for the Chiefs this season. Berry could be the teams 1st round selection, but more than likely he won’t be a Chief next season. Any position can be addressed in FA, but safety is not our most pressing need right now and upgrades can be had in FA, or late rounds of the draft without big $ involved. WR and LB are this teams most pressing need. TOP and, of course, scoring points is critical for success next year and can help the defense by keeping them off the field. If these two areas of the game don’t improve then the D will remain on the field too long again next season and still lose the majority of our games.
"safety is not our most pressing need"
I would argue that it IS the most pressing need, along with Center and NT.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
I agree Stag.
Our safeties are weak! Especially since Page got hurt.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Dec 28, 2009 12:08 PM CST up reply actions
sure
but, I would argue that the offense, with some more OL improvement, and a couple of other pieces, CAN move the ball and score points… but, that doesn’t help if your defense can’t stop the other team from moving the ball and scoring points.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Safety isn't the most pressing need....
But aside from Suh, Berry looks to be the best football player. The Chiefs are hurting so bad in so many areas that taking the best available player is the best choice. A dominating safety can jump start this flat lining defense. Look at what great safeties have done for their teams: Polamalu, Ed Reed, Steve Atwater, John Lynch, Ronnie Lott… I get the feeling that Eric Berry will fall into rank with these guys.
My sentiments are likely to be summed up with one of these 2 quotes:
"Shut the f--- up."- Matt Cassel
"WHAT THE F---?!?!"- Todd Haley
R.I.P. C.H., #15
by Red N Gold Beast on Dec 28, 2009 12:10 PM CST up reply actions
Besides:
OL is still the biggest need on this team. It’s starting again guys…. we bitch and moan about how awful the OL is, then get all excited when the draft approaches with skill positions and defensive play makers. IMO, after we draft Berry, one of the 2nd rounders and the 3rd rounder need to go to OL help.
My sentiments are likely to be summed up with one of these 2 quotes:
"Shut the f--- up."- Matt Cassel
"WHAT THE F---?!?!"- Todd Haley
R.I.P. C.H., #15
by Red N Gold Beast on Dec 28, 2009 12:13 PM CST up reply actions
2nd/3rd round OL
I agree.
I think the OL is much improved, but you HAVE to keep drafting talent there.
a Center is a must… depth at Tackle is a must… a Guard would be great, as well.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Yeah
Especially considering the way Waters has been playing and acting this year. He’s got the attitude of a guy on his way out the door. We need to get a replacement for him NOW before the Roaf/Shields syndrome creeps up on us again. You want a focal point that points to where the Chiefs stated their consecutive losing seasons skid? Look no further than Carl Peterson not preparing for the loss of his pro bowl offensive linemen. The issue with Brian Waters has the potential to be a repeat of history if Pioli doesn’t plan for this…..
My sentiments are likely to be summed up with one of these 2 quotes:
"Shut the f--- up."- Matt Cassel
"WHAT THE F---?!?!"- Todd Haley
R.I.P. C.H., #15
by Red N Gold Beast on Dec 28, 2009 12:58 PM CST up reply actions
Waters hasn't been acting bad
he’s repeatedly pointed to as a leader, and has done NOTHING to indicate otherwise.
however, I do agree that you have to continuously draft and build the line EVERY year.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Ok, Maybe not so much the way he's acting.
Aside from the alleged things that happened at the beginning of the off season, he’s been the veteran leader he’s always been. But his on the field play has slipped. He’s drawn an awful lot of holding penalties, and his overall enthusiasm just doesn’t seem to be there.
My sentiments are likely to be summed up with one of these 2 quotes:
"Shut the f--- up."- Matt Cassel
"WHAT THE F---?!?!"- Todd Haley
R.I.P. C.H., #15
by Red N Gold Beast on Dec 28, 2009 2:05 PM CST up reply actions
penalties have been an issue
his overall play has been as solid as anyone on the line (which, I know, doesn’t say THAT much)
Look at Beswaf’s posts… Waters always seems to be getting the top grades on the line.
He may not be as dominant as he was, but he’s still a very good lineman, and I’d be happy to see him back here next season.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
I want him back just see it as a ?
Because I’m sure he wants to walk away from the game and not roll around in a wheel chair for the rest of his life.
I agree Berry looks great and would not complain one bit if we drafted him has anyone heard anything about him leaving/staying?
He hasn't said he's going back.
So I assume he’ll declare when the deadline approaches.
My sentiments are likely to be summed up with one of these 2 quotes:
"Shut the f--- up."- Matt Cassel
"WHAT THE F---?!?!"- Todd Haley
R.I.P. C.H., #15
by Red N Gold Beast on Dec 28, 2009 12:15 PM CST up reply actions
he said he'd announce it after their bowl game
which, to me, means he’s leaving
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
The safeties
you mention all played on teams with dominant offensive players, except for Reed and Lynch. Tampa’s offense was okay, but was able to control TOP with their running game and hit on some big plays with K. Johnson. That Baltimore defense would be good without Reed.
And what does that have to do with anything?
Maybe those offenses were better because they played on teams with dominant defenses? Maybe having a D that forced punts and took the ball away on turnovers gave the offense more chances to rack up yards and points?
It’s a team sport. All phases have to be good. Offense, Defense and Special Teams rely on each other. My specific point was that a bad ass safety can be the leader and heart of a bad ass defense.
Sheesh…. leave it to these yahoos that believe the offense is the most important part of a team to try to ruin a point that I had.
My sentiments are likely to be summed up with one of these 2 quotes:
"Shut the f--- up."- Matt Cassel
"WHAT THE F---?!?!"- Todd Haley
R.I.P. C.H., #15
by Red N Gold Beast on Dec 28, 2009 12:52 PM CST up reply actions
It should have been obvious
Sorry about your point, which I guess was that without these safeties their teams would not have been winners. San Fran wasn’t a dominating defense, but did have a dominant offense – so I guess the point is you can win 5 SB’s with a good offense. Another point would be – take Elway and T. Davis out of Denver and Atwater would not have carried the team to a Superbowl. Denver could have won those SB’s without Atwater, but not without their explosive offense. One safety is not going to help this defense get off the field, but more TOP can help the defense by keeping them off the field. What is a yahoo?
San Fran actually DID have a dominating defense.
Ronnie Lott, Ken Norton, those guys were insane! Their defense was as good as any in the league back in the Montana/Young eras.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Dec 28, 2009 2:56 PM CST up reply actions
Thats open to debate
Lott was awesome, no doubt about that. Norton spent most of his years in Dallas and did not play for SF while Montana was there. Haley and the defensive front was good, but no where near dominating. Their LB’s were good enough. NY, Bears, WA and Philly were the most dominating defenses in the 80’s and 90’s, but none of those teams could compete with SF’s offense and the proof is in the SB wins. Were just gonna have to agree to disagree on this one. You may be right and the Chiefs may pick Berry in the draft, but I doubt they do. We’ll see.
Red N Gold
Right on! Our defense needs that impact player. He can cover, run, blitz, and tackle. These impact players are rare (i.e. Derrick Thomas) and if they are available take them.
"WR and LB are this teams most pressing need"
I agree that we need a really talented WR to help us out but, I really think the addition of a dominant NT will improve the play of the LBs. I’m not saying we don’t need an upgrade there but, these young guys could be pretty good if the D-line were playing better.
yep
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
* Stats are for losers
Stag & 1970
I like to read your opinion, but disagree with your evaluation of our LBs. Our current lack of talent at LBs especially ILB is killing the defense’s ability to stop the run. While i do not want to pick an ILB with a top five pick, we have to improve our talent level in this draft at LB with one or two picks.
As bad as this football team is
I think you have to go for best athlete available, except for QB
The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.
Rather have best football player instead of athlete hell DHB was one of the best in shorts coming into the draft, same for Reggie Bush entering his draft
no argument
that’s really what I mean, best player on the board
The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.
I couldn't disagree more
You don’t burn a top 5 pick on a guy just because he’s the shit. Drafting top 5 means you have major needs so you better make it count and fill one of those needs. If the guy is redundant, there’s no reason whatsoever to waste the pick on him.
Braccae illae virides cum subucula rosea et tunica Caledonia-quam elenganter concinnatur!
I think it comes down to need/upgrade
Compare our current NT to Suh and how big of an upgrade is that? A player in a position that takes a couple of years to develop into a force, when we have a serviceable one available.
Then compare our current safety situation vs the availability of Berry. Position that is generally a faster transition for a rookie player, with the ability to be an instant upgrade with veteran tutelage available.
Personally, I think Berry is the smarter pick all around. Faster impact, personally I think it’s a bigger need, and more guaranteed performance. I agree with the earlier sentiment that it would be better to fork out cash for a proven veteran NT in free agency, than to draft and develop one.
Lets focus on the COACHING...
Your right! Pioli had to wait for Haley to finish the superbowl, and by that time, Clancy was the best available..lol. I am optimistic on the Weis (even though he’s not in good football shape)….But seriously, i dont know where all the Romeo stuff comes from. Does he live in Kansas City or what? It would suprise me if he ever coaches again, much less for the Chiefs. Please someone explain. I would be prepare (good or bad), for maybe Zorn as a QB coach…D. Juron could be considered, but no way i see Coors light Crommel coming out of his recliner to coach.
Best OC and DC
Who do you think would be best Oc and DC for Kc?
by BBell78 on Dec 28, 2009 1:32 PM CST via mobile reply actions
write a post and give it a poll...
iam not taking that one on myself, but it would be interesting to see who could be available….Chris and Joel might have some better insight. Coaching is huge, and it should be as important as the mock drafts posted 3 times a day …

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