Looking Down From The Mountaintop
This is my first fanpost, so correct me if I do anything wrong (but cut me a little slack). First of all, my apologies if the title is a bit ambiguous. I was originally going to title it "A Different Perspective", but I think I have seen posts in the past with that title, and I wanted something "catchy". Anyway…
I think there are a couple of things that fans are overlooking when getting down on the current state of the Chiefs:
1) This is pretty obvious, but people tend to forget sometimes. Todd Haley was brought in LATE and resultantly did not have much to pick from in terms of assembling his coaching staff. I put the primary amount of blame for this on Clark Hunt and his "slow and methodical approach" that he preached about. It would not surprise me to see two new coordinators next off-season. Which sucks, as this will cause a need for more transition time. In any case, regardless of the situation, he was, in fact, brought in very late.
2) I am not sure a lot of people realize this second point, and it is really the main reason for my writing this. If you were to speak of the Chiefs team that this regime inherited and the ONLY thing you were to say was, "they only won six games in the last the two years", you would actually be painting a picture of the Chiefs that was OVERLY FLATTERING!
Why, you ask? I will be happy to elucidate.
This team not only won a paltry six games in two years, they managed to be ON THE DECLINE FOR THE ENTIRETY OF THOSE TWO YEARS WHILE DOING IT! Four games were won in the first seven games of the first season, followed by losing the last nine in a row, ending at 4 – 12. The following season was 2 – 14. This team was GETTING WORSE!
In summary, I guess my point is that the first step in getting things on the right track is NOT to improve this team, but to STOP IT FROM GETTING WORSE. We first have to put the skids on the previous path of declination. If we manage one more win this year that has been accomplished. When you also consider that, while attempting this task, Haley has a coaching staff that is not likely made up of members that were high on his list of preference, it is not surprising where the Chiefs are at currently.
Just my perspective. Go Chiefs!
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.
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Good thoughts!
Welcome and thanks for posting. I like the way that your thinking.
I’ve listened to many people complain about the Chiefs progress (or their perceived lack of progress) throughout this year. I guess this is a very subjective thing.
Personally, its my belief that the Chiefs are actually much better from last year. Barring the Chargers game, this year we’ve been competitive with teams that we wouldn’t have had a chance of beating last year (Giants, Ravens & Cowboys), with a more conventional offense. Specifically, our defense is leaps and bounds better than last year, which has helped alot.
Anyway, good post and thanks for adding your thoughts.
"Every day is an evaluation and if you’re not out there how can we depend on you? If you’re out there and you don’t know what to do, how can we depend on you?" Accountability -- Haley-style...
by Chief_Elmo on Nov 6, 2009 1:58 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Nice post
Pioli and Haley are going to have time to prove themselves. They aren’t going to be thrown out the window after one year (unless Pioli decides to make Haley a scapegoat).
My main criticism of Pioli specifically is that he did not build on what was already here.
He did not take advantage of the sacrifice the previous regime made of getting those young players experience and instead began discarding players he did not see as Pro Bowl caliber, even though the “Right 53” that were kept are not performing to the level of the guys that were cut.
It bothers me that Pioli is so intent on developing his own legacy (why else would he leave the Patriots where he had everything he could ever want EXCEPT credit for the team?) that he is willing to put up with it being horrible for several more years.
Yes, the previous regimes record was terrible. But last year they were terrible because they were playing young players with the view to building a foundation to build the future on. Pioli walked in and decided he didn’t give a crap about that so he got rid of some of those young players with no one qualified to replace them just for the sake of getting rid of them. I have a problem with that.
He brought in washed up veterans because he thought the team was too young. We’re still losing, even worse than last year. And instead of developing young players while we lose, we’re losing with washed up guys that will be gone in a year or two.
I’m frustrated with Pioli because I think he set the rebuilding process back rather than moving it forward.
by ChiefDJ on Nov 6, 2009 2:12 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
We actually lost a crap load of close games last season.
We were competitive. You cant say we were as bad as the 2-14 record indicates. Its not fair to say we hung in games this year, so we are better than last year. Same deal…close games we lose. Whose fault is that?…..could be coaching. But if two different coaches are doing this and falling victim to late games, could it be the losing culture? Could it be our locker room hasnt had a true leader since Marty…..
It could be a lot of things…..but I dont believe we are better than any previous year.
"Its going to be a challenge, its going to feel like forever, and there will be difficulties. But we will emerge on the other side of it stronger than we were when we entered." ~ Sudden
by Matt_Grbac on Nov 6, 2009 2:13 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
We are more fit / better conditioned
We are not riddled with the kinds of injuries we had the last 2 years. 4-6 players are not being carted off the field every game.
I'm not a smart man
by Gumpster on Nov 6, 2009 4:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
REALLY?
Kind of tired about hearing how much weight the guys have lost when they are still getting blown out in the 4th quarter. Who gives a crap?
I don’t believe there are really less injuries either. It seems like most of the injuries are happnening in practice where, you know, they do us a lot of good.
by ChiefDJ on Nov 6, 2009 5:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Whether or not it has resulted in wins...
I think we can all agree that the conditioning plan has been improved.
by Dove40 on Nov 6, 2009 6:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Difference is
last year we ran a collegiate style offense. No room to actually improve from and truly develop players into top notch NFL caliber team.
This year we are running a pro-style offense. Huge, huge improvement right there. Allows the team to actually develop. I have heard the debate that people think Haley should temper things back down or consider running more of the spread like we did last year. And to this I ask why? Why would you want to lower the expected level of performance? Keep the bar high and demand that the players work to that level…or they be gone.
Our attitude is changing, therefore we are already making an improvement over last year.
by RodeoChief on Nov 6, 2009 7:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
not exactly
43% of NFL games were decided by 7 points or less….the fact that the Chiefs played in a lot of them is an outliier but the close game arguement doesn’t really work when almost half of all NFL games end that way. I won’t deny that last year was more entertaining than this year has been but I also don’t think it was sustainable while what they are doing now may be (I hope)
by skibum1537 on Nov 6, 2009 9:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well said, I like your perspective
It’s a funny duality,
- most fans want the team to be different and better… but they also want to hold on to the players that they have grown to love.
- most fans want the team to get better… but all they can focus on is how poorly they’ve performed at times this year
- most fans liked Haley’s no BS approach… but now they are ripping apart every move he makes, based on the FAN’s view of the rationale behind the decisions NOT the true Chiefs’ management perspective….
WHO are we to say that they “have no idea” or “no direction” or are “amateurs”? WE ARE THE AMATEURS!!! WE don’t see all that happens behind closed doors. WE don’t know what Pioli/Haley are thinking or planning for down the road.
If we could step inside their office for a few days, I’m sure we’d understand what’s going on… but we can’t, so we don’t.
I’m not giving anyone a “free pass”, and the product on the field DOES have to improve… but I think that OUR analysis is probably more often than not based on emotion and opinion, not based on the facts or how things REALLY work behind the scenes
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Nov 6, 2009 2:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yes we are amateurs and they are the professionals
But I think you have to admit that Pioli and Haley thought they were going to walk in here and at least turn this team into a .500 team based on their own football knowledge alone.
I think we are seeing both Haley and Pioli being humbled a bit. Neither of them have been responsible for building a winner on their own before. They are finding out that there is more to it than just copying the types of moves or motivational tactics that other winners have used.
Succesful coaches and GMs have a knack for it. They don’t just copy what a genius coach like Parcells does. They have to have that ability themselves.
by ChiefDJ on Nov 6, 2009 2:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Its kinda hard
When you have no apparent identity. Are we a smash mouth run it up the gut team…are we an air attack Cardinals team, are we a trick play Dolphins team, are we a balanced 50/50 team, what the heck are we??
How do you find players that fit a system that has no identity?? Do we need young guys? Do we need veterans? Do we need fast elusive players? Do we need powerful strong slower runners? Do we need possession WR or speed demons? Do we need Man corners or zone?
They need to find our Indentity first….then maybe we can work on other things…
"Its going to be a challenge, its going to feel like forever, and there will be difficulties. But we will emerge on the other side of it stronger than we were when we entered." ~ Sudden
by Matt_Grbac on Nov 6, 2009 2:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah... I was hoping for a .500 team...
but, that was just the eternal optimist in me.
I think they were expecting one of 2 things…
EITHER… come in, and change everything and win right away
OR…. come in, change everything… knowing that 2009 would be somewhat of a lost season… and set up for a good year in 2010, and a long term winning franchise.
I’m pretty sure it was the latter.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Nov 6, 2009 2:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Still no identity
Its like…they changed team personel just for the sake of changing. No reasons behind getting rid of Pollard, McBride, or Tank…other than to get different guys in here. How does Brown fit over Pollard? How does Edwards fit over Tank? They are not showing any explanations as to why some guys are the right 53 and some are not…..
"Its going to be a challenge, its going to feel like forever, and there will be difficulties. But we will emerge on the other side of it stronger than we were when we entered." ~ Sudden
by Matt_Grbac on Nov 6, 2009 2:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed, the identity hasn't been revealed yet
but, to be fair, I’m not sure that ANY coach or GM explains how a player “fits” or doesn’t fit…
they just make moves based on THEIR plan… regardless of public opinion
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Nov 6, 2009 2:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the identity hasn't been revealed or ESTABLISHED yet
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
by stagdsp on Nov 6, 2009 2:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Haley has said
that he wants this to me more of a run-oriented team but there isn’t any way thatis going to happen with what we have now. After next years draft & free agent signings & another full training camp, I think we will start to become what Pioli & Haley envision us as being. They seem to know what they want but we have to realize that it is going to be a journey to get there, not a hop in the car & cruise on over trip!
by ttownmikey on Nov 6, 2009 4:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
See I kinda' lean this direction too...I think they really REALLY believed..
they were going to change this thing pretty quickly. I think their shocked as well…
by krayfish on Nov 6, 2009 5:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow Dove...
Nice posting. Hope to see much more.
Don't forget to be an AP-vangelist...Tell A Friend...
by woodman212 on Nov 6, 2009 2:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Thanks Dove
Nice post, and I agree with you about these points. There is a process to making anything, and everything that is worth something takes time.
I'm not a smart man
by Gumpster on Nov 6, 2009 4:54 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Ok cool...
that’s a good post…which is saying a lot considering the subject matter is similiar to several others recently, you did a nice job of presenting your case too.
Nice first post.
by krayfish on Nov 6, 2009 5:28 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
There are mountains in KC?
I missed that…I really like the use of the word elucidate.
Overall, nice post, I’m just breaking yer balls.
by Ren on Nov 6, 2009 6:03 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Just Arrowhead
Don't forget to be an AP-vangelist...Tell A Friend...
by woodman212 on Nov 7, 2009 12:05 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe not in KC
but Missouri has the Ozark Mountains
and Kansas has…well…

"There are few secrets in football. So execute." ~Coach Stram
"I think it's the fans. The place is crazy. It's a good crazy, if you're Kansas City." ~Coach Schottenheimer
by Bad Medicine on Nov 7, 2009 4:02 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks to all
that have responded and complimented (youse especially).
by Dove40 on Nov 6, 2009 6:49 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

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