Old Good Washed Up Players

by ChiefsFanInTexas on Nov 4, 2009 10:22 AM CST Comment 20 comments

Does this seem to be the trend with the chiefs these days? It's getting pretty old, I never thought I'd say it, but I was more on board with Herm and him getting our team younger. I think Herm evaluated talent very good, or atleast with defense, but he was just a bad time-manager and allaround poor coach. But he started our rebuilding process and got us some pretty solid players. Now that Pioli and Haley came here, its like they don't want to take in something that was part of another Coach that he fired. Instead of keeping Pollard, who was very strong and solid in our D, we in return got nothing for him and he is flourishing for another defense. Hmmmmm...... Questions begin to arise as to why we let go of him, and now Page looks like he might be next on the list on the chopping block after the season ends. I am hoping this does not happen, but I have a feeling that it will. Pioli is wanting to bring his OWN "right 53" players. This is just setting us back further. Especially with the players he is bringing in

We are basically the laughing stock of the NFL. Pioli is proving those who said "Belichick was the heart of the operation and he had the major hand in bringing people in, and selecting who." The lowly Chiefs are picking up scraps from the Pats who they no longer want. These guys he is bringing in from them are not doing anything. And what really gets me is that when you are rebuilding, you want to build for the future, not the present. It looks to be that we are picking up building blocks that are not young and fresh, they are old and washed up. Yes, I admit I was excited that we had picked up Thomas, Toomer, and I still have hopes for Chambers, but come on. Thomas and Toomer couldn't even make the cut on one of the worst teams in the NFL. What does this tell you? It tells me we are looking at names who have proven themselves but have lost a step, or maybe two, or three....or a step out of the league into retirement. This is getting old. We need to start bringing in some younger faces, and holding on to the ones that they have enherited.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

1 recs | Comment 20 comments | Add comment

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

I also meant to add

Herm’s drafts have impressed me incredibly more than Pioli’s. Pioli himself has even cut a player or two from this last draft class I believe. I’m not real sure, but I think I recall us letting go of players we selected this year. Maybe not, anways Pioli needs to step it up this next offseason.

by ChiefsFanInTexas on Nov 4, 2009 10:26 AM CST reply actions 1 recs

I'm not as cynical as a lot of fans on AP yet...

But I totally agree with you there, CFinTX. I want to see what kind of linemen, linebackers, and wideouts Pioli and Haley are looking for. The next offseason will tell me a lot more about their skills as evaluators than this one.

by go_saleaumua on Nov 4, 2009 10:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Why does everyone think Pioli was just going to come in and fix everything in one season?

All of the sudden Bill Beilichick did everything. Pioli didn’t get the executive of the year for watching his coach. I’m still skeptical of some of the moves that he has done, but each has its reason is what I’m assuming. For taking players that are scraps that nobody once is a stretch. We have a player that could be starting RT for sometime for us, and if you look at AZ a receiver that looks to be a productive player.
Be realistic there is a plan even if no one but the front office knows what it is, and I do believe that they will follow it to get us to where we need to be.

by Helmets on Nov 4, 2009 11:27 AM CST reply actions 1 recs

agreed, helmets

the panic and cynicism needs to be tempered.

I do believe they have a plan in place, and that we may not see all of it until next year.

There have been some great “diamonds in the rough” brought in this year:
Lance Long, Ryan O’Callaghan, Corey Mays, Jovan Belcher, Mike Brown, Bobby Wade….

all of these guys are contributing, and several will only get better

NOBODY bats 1000 when picking up FAs and Draft picks. Nobody. Look at all the guys the Pats brought in and ended up cutting…

* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season

by stagdsp on Nov 4, 2009 12:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

1+

by saskwatch on Nov 4, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Not unrealistic

We should be a 500 team this year we have went backwards that is what the problem is. We were atleast competitive last year and fun to watch. The team expecially on offense look like a bunch of SCRUBS trying to play in the NFL

by kcchiefstd on Nov 5, 2009 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

"We were atleast competitive last year and fun to watch"

Really?

KC has won one game(WAS), should have won 2 others (OAK, Dallas)
they were competitive vs Baltimore
a little less so vs Philly, NYG and SD

But… they are not worse than last year by any stretch of the imagination

It would be NICE to be a .500 team this year… and they could be 3-4 at this point, and well on their way to .500…. BUT, you can’t seriously think that with as bad as they’ve been in the last 2 years, and as many changes as have been made this year, that they were EXPECTED to finish 8-8 this year

by stagdsp on Nov 5, 2009 2:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

wow Chiefsfanintexas..

I usually hate everything you say on here. But that is a good article. It’s exactly how I feel too. Good for you…want a pill? (-:

by krayfish on Nov 4, 2009 11:57 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Check the numbers

Not counting draft picks there are 22 players on the active roster that were brought in by Pioli / Haley. Of those 22 only 6 are over 30 (Brown, Chambers, Engram, Goff, Smith, and Vrabel). Now I admit that Brown, Engram, and Goff have not played well and we should of looked for better players at those positions. However, that still leaves 16 players he’s brought in under 30. Half of those 16 are 25 years old or younger.

The NE connection that everyone is complaining about got us our starting QB, defensive leader (Vrabel), our starting 26 year old RT (O’Callaghan), starting ILB (Mays), and a respectable 25 year old #3 QB with some upside (Gutierrez). Why are we so pissed about this?

What about UFAs like Belcher and Walters that made the team? Belcher looks like he could have a future here. Did the Hoodie call Pioli up and tell him to go get him?

Thinking that Pioli could fix our problems in one shortened off season is crazy. Thinking he is only bringing in old players is just plain wrong.

It's a good thing Pioli and Haley aren't running AP or a lot of you guys would of been traded or cut for cast offs from the Pats Pulpit.

by KCporkchop on Nov 4, 2009 12:05 PM CST reply actions 7 recs

VERY well said, Porkchop, wreck

by stagdsp on Nov 4, 2009 12:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Wow

Thanks bringing this post back to reality PorkChop! Definitely worth a rec!

I have to say that posts like this seem based more on emotions than on any real facts. Reading them is depressing, which seems to be the intent…

I’m not sure what spurred this post, but if its bringing in Chambers, then you should relax, take a deep breath and then tell me who is the young guy “out there” (presumably a Free Agent sitting at home) that we can bring in who upgrades our receiving corp better than Chambers. Chambers is a low-risk guy, who I think is better than 4-5 of our current WR.

"Every day is an evaluation and if you’re not out there how can we depend on you? If you’re out there and you don’t know what to do, how can we depend on you?" Accountability -- Haley-style...

by Chief_Elmo on Nov 4, 2009 2:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

exactly...

right on.

by stagdsp on Nov 4, 2009 3:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Out of all that

I like the UFAs and Mays and O’Callaghan are average at best. The rest DID NOT improve are team.

by kcchiefstd on Nov 5, 2009 2:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

for porkchops comment

by kcchiefstd on Nov 5, 2009 2:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Perfect! KCporkchop and HELMETS are right on

Let’s take a breath and gather some common sense here on the way over the top expectations of Pioli and Haley. The Patriots didn’t turn into the monster they are in their first year.

Air Cassel - approved for takeoff

by kabrink on Nov 5, 2009 2:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Pioli plan

I am not going to pretend I know what is in the mind of Pioli and the new folks in charge of the Chiefs. I do know that they have a plan and only time will tell if it works or not. I will venture to guess what they may be up to. NE built of the core of their team via the draft and by acquiring low-priced solid veteran FA’s so it is not a stretch to say that Pioli is going to do the same in K.C. The exception is his signing of Cassel. Pioli feels he has the talent to be the teams QB of the future. Again time will tell if Cassel will live up to these expectations. Pioli may go into the high-priced FA market more in K.C. than NE did, however I don’t feel he will do until he aquires a number of draft choices to his liking.

by chief66 on Nov 4, 2009 2:03 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I will admit

I did not like Herm as a Head Coach but wanted him to take the job of GM I love the players he brought in and Jared only left because of Carl not Herm. Now what Piolli has done to Back that thought up.

Got rid of our best safety and the best TE in football.

Did not upgrade the O-Line witch Herm had already said would be focus of 09 draft.

Downgraded are QB spot and paid ALOT to do it.

Did not git rid of LJ witch it was clear Herm was done with him.

DJ to the bench totally stupid

Alot of people do not agree with this, but everything about the trade with NE was bad. Cassel is NOT a starting QB. Vrabel has lost a step, never was fast and is a half step late almost all the time. All Mays has done is give Haley a stupid reason for not having DJ on the field. Most importantly it cost us a second round pick witch would of been a GOOD OLB/OL.

To me our LB core would be just as effective if not more with Studebaker or MCBRIDE starting oposite of Hali and Johnson starting where Mays is at. not to say, but we would of drafted an OLB in the 2nd rd.

Also the players he brought in are the players we want REPLACED,

Goff who is possibly are worst player.

Brown although solid NOT better than Pollard and we all want Berry anyway.

Mays average but keeping DJ off the field.

My opinion Vrabel to slow and not productive enough, also will need to find replacment this off season.

Engram and company at WR not an upgrade from last year maybe Chambers, Wade, and Long will change that.

Two good picks in the draft terrible. are good ones Jackson and Succop. and one average one in Magee MAYBE. The rest arte pretty much no good or gone.

Those are the MAJOR mistakes already. I hope I’m wrong but I think Billichick had his PAWN in Piolli and now it is showing.

Also all you Herm haters remember Carl and Herm BOTH said it would be atleast THREE years tell we were competitive.
This is year THREE, Carl bailed on Herm and that disgusts me.
If we would of continued with his plan we would not have the same record.

As of now we are sitting with more holes than we had going into the offseason last year and a 60 million dollar QB who could barely find a college team that he could start for.

by kcchiefstd on Nov 5, 2009 2:07 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

....too many points that I disagree with in your comment... can't argue them all

but, here are a couple:

Mays is NOT keeping DJ off the field, Williams is… Mays/Belcher are taking the Pat Thomas spot from last year that was presumed to be Zach Thomas’s job.

The Cassel/Vrabel trade will ultimately be one of the BEST trades for this franchise in years…
Cassel IS a good starting QB, Vrabel IS the leader of the defense, and has really helped the 3-4 transition.

I can’t imagine how you think the QB spot is “downgraded” from last year… Huard/Croyle/Thigpen are in NO WAY better than Cassel/Croyle/Gutierrez

by stagdsp on Nov 5, 2009 2:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Cassel is terrible

Would be much happier with someone else ANYONE else decent such as Troy Smith, Tavaris Jackson, Davis, Pat White, and the list of better canidates than Cassel just keep going.
Some other mistakes made in the front office.
Gailey > Haley as Offensive cordinater
Pendergast and Gibbs < Gunther on D all you have to do is look at the teams they left and what those Ds are doing without them.
And once again Billichick will make the Playoffs after getting rid of Vrabel, Cassel, Seymore, Mays, Stallworth. You really think he would of let Vrabel go if he was that good. You think the comments he made about being better off without Vrabel were wrong I don’t the man knows his football and Vrabel was a mistake also without DJ on the field how hard is it to be the leader of our LB core just look at the starters
Hali first year at LB should just now be starting to put up numbers
Williams decent but to reckless and misses to many tackles
Mays same as Williams except I don’t see him getting much better.
So just because of that means nothing and I say no Williams is not taking Johnsons playing time because with our personel and I dont care about the people who say size matters our LB core should have our best blitzer on the outside that is DJ. One bright spot I believe Belcher > Mays so Hali Williams Belcher and DJ would be a much faster more explosive crew that could get it done.
Anyway I’ve only followed footballl my WHOLE life and LOVE it and the inner workings of what WINNING teams do.

by kcchiefstd on Nov 5, 2009 3:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I tried to like Cassel

My comments during Pre Season I though Cassel had the make up to be very succesful but he has not gotten better in fact I think he has been getting worse. Haley tried to open up the playbook all that happened was Cassel showed how terrible he really is.

by kcchiefstd on Nov 5, 2009 3:34 PM CST reply actions 0 recs