Don't Rush to Judge the Chiefs Offensive Line

by Matt Conner on Oct 8, 2009 9:30 AM CDT in 2009 Campaign Comment 39 comments

It's been the contention of most analysts - both paid sportswriters and raucous fans - that the offensive line is the primary weakness on this Kansas City team. Of course, there are many issues of need on an 0-4 team, but it seems that the few bright spots the Chiefs have don't even have a chance to show themselves because the line fails to give them enough time to pass or open holes and lanes for the running game.

I will say this, just to remind us all: Waters has a Pro Bowl past and is the veteran anchor we were all most excited about - issues with the front office or not. Branden Albert was one of the most heralded rookies last year and made a wonderful transition from guard to left tackle, one of the most difficult positions in the NFL. In fact, if not for fellow rookie Ryan Clady, I have a feeling the attention on Albert would have been overwhelming. So the left side of our line should actually be one of the best in football.

Think also about the state of our most recent competition. Who are the top three blitzing and/or dangerous defenses to go up against in all of football? I would say:

1. Baltimore Ravens
2. Philadelphia Eagles
3. New York Giants

Who did the Chiefs play in three of their first four games?

1. Baltimore Ravens
2. Philadelphia Eagles
3. New York Giants

Even the Raiders are strong in this area, adding the talented Richard Seymour in a surprising pre-season trade. The DE makes life hard for whoever he goes against. And let's not forget the free agent signing of Greg Ellis, whose pass rushing abilities not only are still evident for the Raiders (4 sacks in 4 games), but just look at what DeMarcus Ware - the reigning sack champion - is doing without the talent of his former teammate, Ellis: 0 sacks, 13 tackles and easily the worst season of his career in the making.

Certainly, NFL caliber players should be able to play well at any period and proper coaching and game-planning should make adjustments when necessary. But that's another topic for another time. If anything, we shouldn't rush to judgment on the state of our offensive line until the bye week at the very least. And because we're all in this for the long haul, I'd rather see O'Callaghan, Niswanger and Goff (or Alleman) get the rest of the starts of '09 just so we completely know what we have in house before our first full off-season with Scott Pioli and Todd Haley.

Poll

What do you think at this point about the Chiefs O-Line?

Yeah, give it time to see what the full season brings.

417 votes

No way, I've seen enough already.

248 votes

665 votes | Poll has closed

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Comments

there are some solid pieces in place

Waters, Albert, O’Callaghan are all fully capable linemen
Goff and Niswanger could use improvement.

I think they will be a solid group by the end of the year… they just have to figure out the protections and get used to playing together.

I’d really like to see Ndukwe in at RG, of course… but then, stop moving guys around, at least for this year, and see what they have got.

I bet we’ll be pleasantly surprised by the end of the year

* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season

by stagdsp on Oct 8, 2009 9:39 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I look at it like this.

Albert – will be good, just needs time
Waters – still good but starting to decline
Niswanger – seen enough, needs to be upgraded
Goff – seen enough, needs to be upgraded
O’Callaghan – like what I saw last week, willing to give him this year to win the job

Like stagdsp said, I would also like to see Ndukwe at RG. That move would require us to get another T on the active roster though, even if it was just bringing up Richardson.

It's a good thing Pioli and Haley aren't running AP or a lot of you guys would of been traded or cut for cast offs from the Pats Pulpit.

by KCporkchop on Oct 8, 2009 9:44 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Took the words from my mouth

by mushin on Oct 8, 2009 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

+2

We Will kick at least 4 Teams Asses in 09
And Succop will be the Key in two of them.
" Think and talk positive football off the field." Hank Stram

by Steve_Chiefs on Oct 8, 2009 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I've lost all

confidence in Niswanger, he is not getting it done! Geoff is serviceable but Chiefs need to find his replacement pretty quick, Waters is also getting up in age, I did think O’Callagahan looked pretty decent for his first real start for the Chiefs, so that’s promising.

But the O-line is still struggling and needs more talent.

by JohnNdallas on Oct 8, 2009 9:44 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Albert did EVERYTHING the coaches asked of him yet he has regressed (FACT)

The coaching stuff messed up on this one. Albert should not have lost all that weight. Hes not comfortable at this size and hes getting pushed around more than he did last year. Its going to take an off season of beefing back up to get him back up to his level of last year. That is IF the coaching staff will acknowledge their mistake

I don't want no Yo-Yos

by AK_47 on Oct 8, 2009 9:46 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't know

it seems to me that his biggest problems have been mental. It seems to me that I’ve seen him get beat by guys on the outside more then I have seen him get “pushed around” as you said. If anything, being in better shape should help him keep containment on the outside rush. Also, don’t forget that much of last season the Chiefs were working out of the “arrowspread” which gave the linemen some space to work with (not to mention) Thigpen’s ability to take off when things broke down.

It's a good thing Pioli and Haley aren't running AP or a lot of you guys would of been traded or cut for cast offs from the Pats Pulpit.

by KCporkchop on Oct 8, 2009 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So then maybe hes been overrated all along and now the new scheme is exposing that?

I don't want no Yo-Yos

by AK_47 on Oct 8, 2009 9:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

My main point is that the coaching staff has praised him for doing everything they've asked yet he atleast hasn't progressed at all

That is deeply concerning

I don't want no Yo-Yos

by AK_47 on Oct 8, 2009 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

True enough

I for one wouldn’t have a problem if they went after a new LT this off season and moved Albert to G. I know a lot of people would consider that a waste, but if it upgrades 2 positions for us then I say do it.

It's a good thing Pioli and Haley aren't running AP or a lot of you guys would of been traded or cut for cast offs from the Pats Pulpit.

by KCporkchop on Oct 8, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not a bad idea

Move Waters to center. That would leave RG as the big need left. Only problem with finding a new LT is they are hard to find and you have to use a high pick to get a good one. Especially one that will make the immediate impact that we need.

I don't want no Yo-Yos

by AK_47 on Oct 8, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well we MIGHT Have another Top 3 pick

I think that’s high enough for a good Left Tackle :)

by Ryan in Nixa on Oct 8, 2009 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

this has been a big topic lately

people on both sides have good points too…. taking Oline with a 1st round pick when we have 2 2nd round picks or taking a LB or Safety in the first but its all a gamble no matter where your go with the pick ihave my opinion on this but im gonna let it ride out and see what the team does then next year about this time i will come back to it

by redmedicone on Oct 8, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I have a gut feeling

That Albert will be moved inside to LG next off-season and we’ll take a new LT in round 1.

I think Waters will be gone after this year and we’ll draft a center.

I also agree with others that Ndukewe should be tried at RG. Not sure why we’re sticking with Goff.

by golfbard on Oct 8, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

$

$$$$$

We Will kick at least 4 Teams Asses in 09
And Succop will be the Key in two of them.
" Think and talk positive football off the field." Hank Stram

by Steve_Chiefs on Oct 8, 2009 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

RG

Is Geoff really better than Alleman? If not, then doesn’t Alleman have a background of playing Center? (Would he be better than Rudy?)

My only fear with Albert is this: Did he only look so great last year because we were in the Pistol offense (which was put in to hide weakness of O-line and Thigpen fit that style better)? If we would have played a conventional offense last year, would Albert have looked just as bad?

by vincent2668 on Oct 8, 2009 9:50 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Blocking may not be the biggest problem the OL

This article talks a lot about how our OL might not be as bad at blocking as we think it is. But what about the fact that they’re constantly drawing penalties. I don’t think personnel is necessarily the biggest problem with our offensive line, but maybe the actual coaching of the line itself. There is no reason that they should have so many false starts, especially when they’re at home and the crowd is silent on offense.

by Yashi on Oct 8, 2009 10:00 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Exactly.

Especially for Albert. Very costly penalties at very bad times.

Cantaloupe? More like wontaloupe. Lazy ass melons.

by cucuybird on Oct 8, 2009 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lack of talent leads to Penelties

I will say that when you are constantly outmatched talent-wise. That leads itselfs more holding penelties and false starts. How many times in the 90s did you see left takles going against Derrik Thomas that would constantly get called for holding or false starts because they were so outmatched; trying anything to slow him down (Holding – jumping early because they were getting beat so bad)
I tend to think that is more of what is happening here.

by vincent2668 on Oct 8, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So does trying too hard

by mushin on Oct 8, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'll take this discussion a step further

Check out this link of scheduled free agent O-lineman…

http://www.footballsfuture.com/2010/fa/ol.html

Now some might get tagged but some also will walk

by golfbard on Oct 8, 2009 10:58 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

well outta them all i think

Daryn Colledge, Green Bay Packers might be the best one that could happen since it says the packers are going to have to try and lock up other guys and worry about money for them and he could fill a guard spot but idk if we would want a packer line guy they gave up 9 sacks the other day against the vickings

by redmedicone on Oct 8, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is the guy that got torched time and time again by Jared Allen on Monday. I know Allen is awesome, but it was basically every play. Meh.

by augmental on Oct 8, 2009 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Look for the Chiefs

to take one of those two linemen from the Patriots.

I know the Pats don’t want to part with Neil, but they might not have a choice.

by jcru on Oct 8, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't forget that the CBA is going to play hell with free agency next year

by mushin on Oct 8, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Waters is not an anchor any more

Guys…have you actually watched #54 of late? A bunch of whiffs, a bunch of standing around. LJ has been running a bunch behind him and Waters has simply not been opening the hole we are used to seeing there…I do think opponents are a factor, but watch Waters as the season goes on…I’m worried.

by ArowhedKC on Oct 8, 2009 11:39 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Waters is

a straight ahead blocker. AT Center you wouldn’t ask him to get outside, just get to the second level and get on a LBer.

by JohnNdallas on Oct 8, 2009 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

under Vermeil, Waters was part of a line that was known for guards pulling on almost every play ...

that whole unit was one of the most mobile OLs in the NFL, including Waters

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!

by upamtn on Oct 8, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

That was then

this is now. Unfortunately speed and skills declining with age and wear is a law and not an option.

by JohnNdallas on Oct 8, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

But you are correct up

The Chiefs back in the day could use any of their O-Linemen to pull, including Wiegman. There haven’t been many Centers that could function as a lead blocker on sweeps and screens as effectively as Wiegman did/dose? (not sure if the donks ask him to pull now or not)

by JohnNdallas on Oct 8, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs