Are You In Favor Of Winning At All Costs?
How desperate are you to be a winner?
The range of sports fan philosophies can range anywhere between "It doesn't matter if you go 16-0, if you don't win the Super Bowl you are a failure" to "I don't really care if they win as long as the game is entertaining".
Right now Chiefs fans are seeing a huge transition in how the organization deals with its players and fans.
The previous regime under Carl Peterson, who combined the football operations with marketing and sales, spent a lot of time trying to make the team attractive to the fans, even if that didn't always lead to the ultimate success on the field.
The "Arrowhead Experience" as we know it today was cultivated and promoted during that time. The players were held up as idols to the fans to the point that many went to the games just to watch Derrick Thomas, Tony Gonzalez and Priest Holmes, and if the Chiefs won, well that was a bonus. Players that had been loyal to the organization were rewarded, often to the detriment of the team as a whole, but this too was part of the entertainment value to the fans. Fans don't like to see their favorite players mistreated. It was required by the organization that the players must give back to the community and you could see the evidence of their charity hanging on banners from the walls of the stadium.
No matter how many people expressed their dislike for Petersons way of business and the lack of playoff victories in recent years, Arrowhead was always full of people enjoying their Sundays watching their favorite players, even when the results were mediocre.
The new regime under Scott Pioli, however, is shaping up to be very very different.
Pioli learned the "Patriot Way" under Bill Belichick who, despite being one of the most brilliant coaches in NFL history, is also an undeniably ruthless, iron fisted tyrant who is infamous for his secrecy and combative relationship with the media.
Bellichicks success has made it possible for him to get away with being an anti-social curmudgeon. Fans love to see their team win and will put up with behavior that they otherwise wouldn't. The excitement of seeing the best team in football on Sunday goes a long ways to making up for the drudgery of Monday through Saturday of boring, information-less press conferences and a cloak of secrecy draped over every move the team makes.
Seeing fan favorite players that have been loyal to the Patriots organization like Vrabel and Seymour exiled to teams like the Chiefs and Raiders that are scraping the NFL gutter would outrage most Chiefs fans. Look at the uproar over the Jared Allen trade. Yet there is a consistent theme you hear repeated over and over from hardcore Patriots fans no matter what move is made. "In Bill We Trust."
No matter how heartbroken they are to see their favorite players cut or shuttled off for impersonal future draft picks or to find out their team has been cheating by videotaping the other teams sidelines; they have been conditioned to accept whatever it takes in order to win, no matter what.
That is the type of attitude Pioli is bringing to Kansas City. Draping the front office in a veil of secrecy, one of his early moves was to trade future Hall of Famer Tony Gonzalez away for a 2nd round pick two drafts down the road. No nonsense is accepted. Anything not directly having to do with fashioning the team into a winner will not be accepted. The charity banners are gone. If you believe the reports, former Chiefs players who had always been treated as family are being treated as threatening strangers.
The Patriot Way is in full effect in Kansas City. The unanswered question of course, is whether the tactic will be successful without its most important ingredient: Bill Belichick.
But for a moment, let us assume that everything Pioli is planned will have success.
Assume that a few years from now the Chiefs are a shoe-in to the playoffs and have been to the Super Bowl multiple times.
Assume that Pioli will run the Chiefs the same way Belichick runs the Patriots. By this time stocked with talent, we will see favorite players who have hit their peak and are beginning to see the downhill of their career cold-bloodedly cut or traded away for future picks that may or may not turn out to be as good. We will be used to seeing players who break ranks and speak out of turn ruthlessly slapped down and we as fans will be locked out of the inner workings of the team. Former players are kept at a distance instead of continuing to be a part of the organization. Once they have outlived their usefulness on Sundays, they are given a thank you and discarded. Anything that does not directly lead to victory on Sunday is a mere side note.
The question is, are we so desperate for victory that we are ready to go that hardcore to win? Are we willing to be held at a distance and accept unpopular moves if it means we are consistently one of the best teams in the league? Are you willing to give up hero worship of players if it is in the best interest of the team?
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49 comments
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Comments
Steroids, filming practices, stealing signals, whatever it takes, just win baby.
"What?!?! I aint no Obama for the weed!"
-Turk McBride
by HIV 2 Elway on Oct 6, 2009 6:33 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Winning without honor is an empty win
When those players step on the field, they should be ruthless. If they go out there and play the game the way it was meant to be played, then they will do just fine in the league and I will be proud of them. Once off the field, they should behave as human beings, no special than the rest of us. I would rather have a tough team that will go out there, smash you in the mouth for the full 60 minutes, then shake your hand and have nothing but good words for the opposing team…win or lose. THAT is a team that I can be proud of and the sign of a classy organization. That is what we had in the 90s and we can still get it back without being a “win at all costs” organization.
by chiefsandcigars on Oct 6, 2009 6:39 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
There was no option for "Win at all costs, within the rules of the game."
So i went with scorched earth.
Cantaloupe? More like wontaloupe. Lazy ass melons.
by cucuybird on Oct 6, 2009 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1 Million chiefsandcigars
I think way too many people forget that, at bottom, it’s a sport … and of course the offshoot of that word: sportsmanship
just as college football has turned kids from being Student/Athletes to being Athlete/Students the emphasis on (major) sports now is …
$port$
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
by upamtn on Oct 6, 2009 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we are on the right path
I like whats being done and where they are trying to go. It will take time and there will be growing pains along the way. Once everything is said and done, though, our organization will once again be the envy of the league.
by chiefsandcigars on Oct 6, 2009 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thx Chiefsand cigars
I’m kinda disappointed the way the vote has come out. I thought we left that attitude behind in the 80s, but the financia meltdown suggests we didn’t. Now this vote. sigh
No question. Otis Taylor should be in the Hall of Fame.
by hmills110 on Oct 6, 2009 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Having said that,
Marty ball only took us (or any other team) so far. So I definitely want something less hidebound, but not at the cost of the Chiefs’ integrity.
No question. Otis Taylor should be in the Hall of Fame.
by hmills110 on Oct 6, 2009 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I find the results interesting
But I’m curious as to how many people REALLY believe that winning is all that matter and how much of that is people saying what they THINK they should believe.
To me, the “Nothing matters but the hardware” line is just a sports cliche. Just like “We’re giving 110%” and “The coach of that 0-15 team is a damn fine coach and is working hard”. I think its saying what you think you’re supposed to say.
When an athlete says “Nothing matters but a championship”, he of course doesn’t really mean it. If he did, he would forgo his $20 million salary and play for the league minimum so other great players could be on the team and thus give them a better chance to win the championship.
Fans are the same way. If a team ran the ball 60 times a game for 3 1/2 yards a carry and won every game at 6-3, I think a lot of people would become incredibly bored, even IF they always won.
For players, owners, coaches, etc. winning = more money + prestige.
For fans, sports is about entertainment. Fans actually LOSE money going to sporting events. So if they are not entertained, even if they are winning, it only goes so far.
by ChiefDJ on Oct 6, 2009 9:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The entertianment factor
That’s also why so many people loved Vermeil, despite the fact he never won in the playoffs.
Though for the majority of the time they were pretty mediocre teams, the offense was entertaining. People could deal with the mediocrity as long as the games were fun to watch.
They may not have been happy with mediocrity, but the entertainment value was high enough that they still filled the stadium.
by ChiefDJ on Oct 6, 2009 9:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A Championship would be nice...
but there is no reason one cant be gotten the right way. If the Chiefs signed Tank Johnson, Michael Vick, Pacman Jones, Braylon Edwards, Plaxico Burress, and anyother castaway misfit then Im not sure I would like that at all.
Desperately hoping for Desperate Measures
by averagegatsby on Oct 6, 2009 6:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
that would be the "dallas" way
not the “patriot” way. it takes a certain kind of personality to buy into this system, i believe. does anyone remember the character issues marty had on his last couple of teams here? i wasn’t a fan of that at all
Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
Harry S. Truman
by kcguy on Oct 6, 2009 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
2nd
We Will kick at least 4 Teams Asses in 09
And Succop will be the Key in two of them.
" Think and talk positive football off the field." Hank Stram
by Steve_Chiefs on Oct 6, 2009 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but Randy Moss would be ok ... remember the old Randy?
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
by upamtn on Oct 6, 2009 8:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i don't remember randy going to jail
or being involved in some sort of drug and stolen car trafficking operation. maybe i just missed that.
Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
Harry S. Truman
by kcguy on Oct 6, 2009 8:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
For real the only thing Randy was accused of was...
being lazy and quitting on his team.
by butchcassidy on Oct 6, 2009 8:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want to win
Find it hard to believe Carl cared about anything but himself otherwise GANNON would of been a SB Champ in KC.
Allen would still be here!!!!
Smith would have never ended up in Denver!!!
and the list goes on of things the fans definatly did not want.
That is why the majority of us can not stand Carl.
The only thing Carl had to hand his hat on was DT.
by kcchiefstd on Oct 6, 2009 6:47 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Honestly, none of those answers n the poll reflect mine and others views
How about this one… ’All I care about is winning a superbowl"
by krayfish on Oct 6, 2009 6:52 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
these guys have one job, win games...
I also don’t believe that the “patriot way” is an at all costs type of thing. Hell why do players love playing for Belichek, but the guy has a team to run. It’s folly to be loyal to players who can’t help you, it will end up killing you in the end, or as we are experiencing, give you several years of poor performance.
Your poll gives no good answer.
Everyone is happy when the team wins.
by tebunker on Oct 6, 2009 6:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
everyone is happy when the team wins
but when the team loses in the playoffs then we all sulk and have to wait till next year, unlike the fans of that one lucky team each year. And honestly i want to watch a Chiefs Superbowl “apperance” sometime in my lifetime!
by jrcnc on Oct 6, 2009 6:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wanted to add
“Assume that Pioli will run the Chiefs the same way Belichick runs the Patriots. By this time stocked with talent, we will see favorite players who have hit their peak and are beginning to see the downhill of their career cold-bloodedly cut or traded away for future picks that may or may not turn out to be as good. We will be used to seeing players who break ranks and speak out of turn ruthlessly slapped down and we as fans will be locked out of the inner workings of the team. Former players are kept at a distance instead of continuing to be a part of the organization. Once they have outlived their usefulness on Sundays, they are given a thank you and discarded. Anything that does not directly lead to victory on Sunday is a mere side note”
What delusional world do you live in that you have the time to dream like this? Really? . . . Really? Go take a real look at the Pats they are not like this.
by tebunker on Oct 6, 2009 6:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Orly?
Troy Brown. Check
Lawyer Milloy. Check
Mike Vrable. Check
Richard Seymour. Check
Ya’rly.
The Kansas City Chief's 2009 record will be 5-11.
by Druful on Oct 6, 2009 7:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they aren't??? wow, you should tell that to Drew Bledsoe
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
by upamtn on Oct 6, 2009 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I grew up in Oklahoma
and didn’t really start following the NFL until high school/ college. I was able to pick my team. I chose the Chiefs because they were a classy organization. The day that ends is the day I’m done with them.
by NJ Chiefs Fan on Oct 6, 2009 7:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
What exactly does "classy organization" mean?
Bill Mass, Tamarack Vanover, Bam Morris, Marty knocking up waitresses, DT knocking up anything in sight, Tony G pounding chicks in Westport bathrooms, Warfield driving drunk, LJ slapping and spitting drinks, River Falls fights, Rison fighting outside the club, Moon beating his wife?
"What?!?! I aint no Obama for the weed!"
-Turk McBride
by HIV 2 Elway on Oct 6, 2009 7:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
like most people that aren't married haven't tried to pound everyone they could.
It’s just a lot easier when your a millionaire and football player
Chiefs set an NFL record,most roster changes in 1 season.
by bringbacktheglory on Oct 6, 2009 8:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you know i jsut want a win! idc how they do it its so hard hearing pepole trash my team everyday and my whole life i never say a word back unless there a raider or broncos fan but its hard hearing that it really is anybody agree?
by kcchiefsfan56 on Oct 6, 2009 7:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
KC fans have had no alternative but to cling to individual players.
There hasn’t been a major championship in KC in nearly a quarter century. The fans have had no choice but to root for individual players.
Toby is in HR, which technically means he works for corporate, so he's really not a part of our family. Also, he's divorced, so he's really not a part of his family.
by Rev. Slappy on Oct 6, 2009 7:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
wait til Thursday and maybe a Tigers-Huskers thread
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
by upamtn on Oct 6, 2009 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't choose any of the poll answers - none appealed to me
Despite Whitlock’s ranting I think the Chiefs are doing more to keep the fans involved than ever. The improved website and the work Looney is huge improvement over anything the Chiefs did under Carl. I don’t care about locker room intrigue as long as I’m getting some reports from the HC and players and see the GM making moves to improve the team.
I want a well run organization that doesn’t make desperation grabs for discipline problems. We need players who stay out of trouble off the field and make trouble for the opposition on the field. And I’m actually not much on the Pats bandwagon – still newcomers. I’m looking for the Chiefs to model themselves on the Steelers.
by Big Chief on Oct 6, 2009 8:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Right on.
The Steelers are an excellent choice as they are perennial winners & New England rarely got to this level until the past decade. But I don’t know what is so unclassy about the Patriots other than the “spygate” affair. Kraft has been a very good owner & bottom line it is a business & all of these traded away Patriots players realize this. They won by being a team & their trades are just part of the business of keeping this team on top & they all understand this. Seymours complaint was that it was the Raiders & who could balme him! Would it surprise anyone if he wasn’t back in New England in a year or two or after his “bigger money” contract runs out???
by ttownmikey on Oct 6, 2009 9:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now this is an interesting proposition.
The poll probably doesn’t slice it the way most would like.
My guess is everyone wants a healthy dose of the Patriot way but the closer way may be the Steeler way. There is also an aspect of the Dallas way that is desireable and that is the spend the money at all cost.
You see I think there was a time when the Chiefs organization absolutely had it right. It was a natural growth out of Mr. Hunt’s dream. What was important was just the survival of the NFL and the franchise. Remember that during the Marty years the danger of a franchise folding/moving was very real. I think Mr. Hunt recognized this and put these concerns ahead of pure winning.
Now it would seem the NFL is very healthy. Winning should now have more focus.
by BCRavenJHawkfan on Oct 6, 2009 8:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The Lamar Hunt way ... now THERE was class! and yeah, the Steeler way ... good!
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
by upamtn on Oct 6, 2009 8:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
what a question. I want to see them win with honor. In other words I want it all . Super bowl champs with good citizens we can be proud to say play for the CHIEFS.
David Logue
by dklogue1 on Oct 6, 2009 8:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm tired of...
… having people feel bad for me because I’m a chiefs fan.
… seeing my chiefs jersey collect dust in the closet because I can’t wear it when the chiefs win.
… hearing other people say “don’t worry, the chiefs are in a rebuilding era, they will be better in a few years.”
… looking at 80% of the schedule as sure fire loses.
… not getting a single night game.
… the sports analysts covering Chiefs games for 5 seconds as side notes then spending 10 min on the colts.
… losing to the Raiders at home.
… nobody (including teams, analysts, and football fans in general) taking the Chiefs seriously.
SO YEAH, START WINNING. NO MATTER WHAT I DON’T CARE.
by Bearson on Oct 6, 2009 9:49 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You gotta love an underdog though
Go Chiefs
Go Royals
No matter what, I’ll still rock my Chiefs gear. Especially at inappropriate venues like court, funerals, and the state of Colorado.
Don't Fuccop Succop
by chicks_love_chiefs on Oct 7, 2009 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
My non vote
Call me greedy but I want it all. I want the Chiefs to win it all and I mean All, and I want to win it all for many years to come I like that word Dynasty and I want to hear it when anyone talks about the Chiefs. I also want to be proud of them not just for winning but off the field things as well. I want Lamar’s dream and class to be what is thought of first when it comes to the Chiefs and then for them to think we are unstoppable. Yes I want to win, but not with problem players, not with the media having a new drama to report on the Chiefs everyday, and Not with out Honor ad class.
I’ll always be a Chiefs fan and I want it all, and I hope one day it will all come together where the Chiefs are not only admired for the way things are run but also for no longer being an underdog but expected to win it all every season.
is it me? or isn't about time the Lamar Hunt trophy belonged to His team?
I’m a Chiefs fan Dammit and I’m damn proud of it!
by KC Fanatic on Oct 7, 2009 6:41 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Right now...
Ill settle for IMPROVEMENT!….thats it, thats all, IMPROVEMENT….not reaching on players in the draftwhen you have the 3rd overall pick, actually bringing in a BIG NAME FA….not a few over the hill guys you dont have to pay much money to and hoping to squeeze a couple more yrs out of…..I dont care what a player does in his personal life for the most part, I pay to watch him play football…his personal life is just that…HIS personal life!….as long as it does not effect his play on the field, i say sign him up….especially when your UNDER the salary cap…..i dont think I have ever seen a team that needs as much help in a re building mode season be UNDER the salary cap…the only person they gave any substantial money to has 15 games of experience in the last 8 yrs!!!!,,,,and im sorry Chiefs fans…it shows!
by KCinAZ on Oct 7, 2009 8:52 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
It's about...
the road to the superbowl, not winning it. Winning would be great, but when it’s over it’s over, and soon forgotten. I’d rather loose and be a chiefs fan than be a Patriots fan with ten superbowls. I agree with kcinaz, let’s see some improvement. That’s what got us so excited about this year to begin with. Herm may have sucked on game day, but at least we saw some improvement.
by 12t on Oct 7, 2009 12:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

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