Here's a snippet from C.E. Wendler at Warpaint Illustrated..

by krayfish on Oct 2, 2009 7:46 AM CDT

I thought you might find the comparisons interesting and was responding to the petition for help since Joel's computer is down. This is not mine or AP's. This is just a cut and paste of some paragraphs from WPI.

"Did Haley do the right thing? Right now, it looks bad, but we have no way of knowing. If the Chiefs are this bad on offense at the end of the season, certainly Haley might look foolish for scrapping Gailey's attack, which had some success last year. But sometimes you have to take two steps backwards to take a step forward. Maybe that’s what this is all about, why Haley is so willing to take the heat.

It wasn’t so long ago (2001) that Dick Vermeil came to town and did the same thing. The year before Vermeil arrived the Chiefs had a top 10 offense, Elvis Grbac went to the Pro Bowl, and the team was two or three wins away from making the playoffs. There didn’t appear to be any reason to scrap the offense.

But that’s exactly what Vermeil did. He dumped Grbac, traded for his own quarterback, installed a completely new offense and then the growing pains started. The quarterback, Trent Green, was terrible, the offense averaged only 17 points during the first six games, and in five of the first eight games the Chiefs had less than 300 yards of offense.

There were plenty of turnovers, missed assignments and players not knowing where they were supposed to line up. It was not that different than it is today. The Chiefs started 1-6, fans were booing, plenty of people probably thought Vermeil was a complete buffoon.

But by the end of the season, the situation improved drastically. Over the last five games, Vermeil’s offense averaged 24 points and well over 300 yards a game. The Chiefs won four of their last seven games" end quote.

I didn't realize that we started out even worse under Vermeil, who as we all know is an offensive mastermind and turned us into the NFL's premiere offense. We outscored, out ran and out played the high powered starlit Colts and Petyont Manning. So I guess we do need keep a chin up and stay positive. We can't expect miracles in 3 games. We still don't even have a team yet. Roster spots are constantly changing and players are still coming and going like crazy.

Anyway. I just wanted to help contribute in Joel's absence, as I have enjoyed this site so much due to the hard work and dedication of the staff here at AP. Thanks guys.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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Very true

The other thing is that before this season started when looking at the schedule there was only 1 maybe 2 games we thought the Chiefs could win. Granted the Raiders game was one of them but they are farther along in their rebuild than we are and we did out play them. At this point being one game down from where they were expected to be at this point should not be reason to panic just yet.

There are signs of life on this team we just have to hold out for this death march at the beginning of the season. If after the bye week we are not making improvement then we should be concerned but the first half of the season is turning out exactly as expected.

Besides we have had uglier games when we were a great team in seasons past than the Eagles game last week, sometimes you just lay an egg.

by tevans96 on Oct 2, 2009 8:24 AM CDT reply actions

Granted the Raiders game was one of them but they are farther along in their rebuild than we are

I disagree – Jamarcus Russell should never start another NFL game, which means they need a QB, which means they are still in Phase One of rebuilding =)

Ryan Succop will be the kicker for the AFC in the 2011 Pro Bowl

by PVChiefsfan on Oct 2, 2009 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions

Todd Haley is no Dick Vermeil

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!

by upamtn on Oct 2, 2009 9:17 AM CDT reply actions

you are missing the point

we all know by now you can’t stand haley but the point of what is being said is that even despite taking over a better football team, vermeil was willing to tear it down, suffer through the growing pains in the short term for hopes of long term success. in other words, there’s a parallel here. haley is willing to suffer in the short term to build this team the way he wants it built in hopes of long term success. we have to wait and see if he will be as successful as dick vermeil was in kc. in other words, we’ll have to wait and see if he can make the playoffs once in five years and lose the first and only game he gets to coach in.

Never kick a fresh turd on a hot day.
Harry S. Truman

by kcguy on Oct 2, 2009 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Guaranteed if AP

had existed when Vermeil 1st took over, then upamtn or various others would have been on here bashing him just as they have been doing to Haley &/or Pioli.
Can you imagine the great debates that would have ensued after the “take off the diapers” statement was made? The lovers & haters would have had a hayday with that one! Or when they got that reject from Baltimore named Priest!
You never know how anything is going to turn out until much further down the road &/or in retrospect when we can then say with certainty: wow that was brilliant after all or what a bone-headed blunder & (of course) one side gets to say I told you so (so try & remember who said what!!:)!
We just have to wait & see but until then the debates will continue, the optimistic will see hope, the pessimistic will see gloom & doom, & I know which of those puts more sunshine in my life!! No matter how bad they look or how bad they play, they are still Our Chiefs :)
Geaux Chiefs!

by ttownmikey on Oct 2, 2009 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions

Thanks for the info Krayfish.

You should be careful however copying and pasting info from another site (especially the case on subscrition sites). You are generally safer to just put a link in a fanshot and put your own comments in. We do not really want to run in to any copyright issues.

by saskwatch on Oct 2, 2009 9:22 AM CDT reply actions

I'm not really sure how that would work. I see quotes on here from AP staff sometimes.

In fact there are quotes on home page right now even. I hope that isn’t an issue but would assume since I posted it and not AP it couldn’t come back on THEM anyway. I would imagine if that was an actual issue they would just delete my post and move on.
I hope that’s not the case though.

by krayfish on Oct 2, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions

Just have to be careful HOW MUCH you quote.

Interesting stuff, though.

by JComp11 on Oct 2, 2009 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions

Just make sure

You’re following the Arrowhead Pride Community Rules.

I believe saskwatch is referring to this portion:

Do not post entire articles from other sites. A link, which is always necessary to any article mention, and a snippet of the article is the max you can do. We can get in trouble for reposting entire pieces. Always link to an article or source you mention. Like I said above. It’s part etiquette and part requirement.

I don’t know if this is the full article or not because I’m not a WPI subscriber. In either case, a link to the article quoted is required.

Don’t worry, you wouldn’t be the first and likely not the last. Like you said, if it is in violation I would think a moderator would edit and/or remove the post.

by Ochophosphate on Oct 2, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions

Here's the link

There’s much more to the story over at Warpath Illustrated under It’s All Haley’s Fault. Good work as usual, Mr. Wendler. (aka bfett on AP)

by sunny D on Oct 2, 2009 10:07 AM CDT reply actions

Thanks, I like the post.

A positive spin on our situation is a good thing. Continually saying that we suck all the time (like in some other posts, over and over) doesn’t make for a positive outlook or very enjoyable reading IMO.

by Supersport on Oct 2, 2009 2:03 PM CDT reply actions

Again, Vermeil had previous coaching experience with success....

I base my opinion on Haley having no prior Head Coaching experience or playing experience to call off of. You have to wonder how much of a leash you give him? I know its been 3 games blah blah. I am not talking about that….I am saying how do we know he is the coach for us…..1yr 2 yr 10yrs…..

I guess we will leave that up to Pioli to decide. I am just afraid of him not having what it takes…and setting us back another 5 years like Herm did.

"Hell yes I love my truck, but I want you to know, honey I love your love the most" - Eric Church

by Matt_Grbac on Oct 2, 2009 2:59 PM CDT reply actions