The Chiefs Sloppiness is Killing Them
by Matt Conner on Oct 12, 2009 11:15 AM CDT
in 2009 Kansas City Chiefs Campaign
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PrintAs late as Friday before game time, it's been made known that Head Coach Todd Haley pulled the Chiefs positional coaches off of the field in a move intended to make a point of the players' sloppiness and the coach's overall displeasure of the session. It's an interesting move that ESPN notes harkens back to Bill Parcells, who made similar moves in his coaching tenure(s). But it's also interesting simply because we, as the audience, had the chance to see the repercussions on the field after such a move.
It's one thing if Haley does this in the offseason with no real ability to tell if it "works" or not (although how can you really know what fully works and what doesn't, since there are so many factors that go into game-time play). But for this display to make some headlines right before a game in which the Kansas City defensive players missed endless amounts of tackles (I mean, Miles Austin for 250? Seriously?) and the Chiefs' running game couldn't find anything (LJ goes 21 for 37? Seriously?)... well, we're just lucky the Cowboys were sloppy enough to keep us in the game.
So while the effort was there, while the final drive was compelling, the reality is that we're still missing tackles, we're still botching plays. It's the penalty from Wade Smith in overtime. It's the horrible technique from the entire secondary. You might have missed it simply because the Cowboys played one of the sloppiest games of any on Sunday, but the Chiefs' own erratic play kept them from being able to capitalize on an easy win.
Rewind to a couple weeks ago when this same thing happened against the Raiders. The Raiders were handing Kansas City the victory and yet we refused to accept it. Here, Dallas gave us a great chance at home to pick up the first win of the season and instead the Chiefs head back to practice 0-5.
I'm not sure what works and what doesn't but something's not working. "Good teams find ways to win" goes the oft-quoted maxim, but some of the teams winning against the Chiefs are leaving happy because we're finding ways to lose.
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fantasy news alert
start any QB, WR or TE against the Chiefs
Do offensive linemen need a positional coach to tell them not to hold or do corners need one to tell them to tackle the freaking receiver?
sunday was a bad day
we got killed by ourselves and our inconsistent D. Mabey if we just played offense in the first half of any game we could have 2 wins. We can do it we did it yesterday.
Defense struggled, yes. But the offense was DOMINATED.
No question. Otis Taylor should be in the Hall of Fame.
This is the million dollar question?
Why do the Chiefs find a way to not win? We have new coach’s,new offense,
new defense,new QB and lots of other new players. But just like last year we find a way to not win the games we could have.
Chiefs set an NFL record,most roster changes in 1 season.
by bringbacktheglory on Oct 12, 2009 11:30 AM CDT reply actions
The Natural
Good movie.
"Leave the gun. Take the cannoli."
"Mr. Pioli is a man who insists on hearing bad news immediately."
"Never tell anybody outside the family what you're thinking again."
by Don Piolie's Consigliere on Oct 12, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Poor tackling has been killing this team for years.
Miles Austin? Really??? I have seen it week after week for a long time now. Hakeem Nicks last week. This week it was Choice and Austin getting away with long gains that should have never happened.
The difference between good and poor defenses is tackling. If you take a lesser talented defense who can tackle well, you will have a decent defense. You can have tons of speed on defense but, if they can’t tackle for shit, moderate players will eat you for lunch.
I thought we fixed the poor tackling by releasing Bernard
Welcome to Chiefs REBUILD - Version 2.0 /The Clark Hunt Edition
Chiefs will be lucky to go 4-12 in 2010
by KansasCityShuffle on Oct 12, 2009 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions
Bernard
By the way, Pollard led Houston in tackles with 6 this week…just a point coaching point
Jerome
I was aware of this fact
been watching his stats and Brown’s closely, you can be sure of that
Welcome to Chiefs REBUILD - Version 2.0 /The Clark Hunt Edition
Chiefs will be lucky to go 4-12 in 2010
by KansasCityShuffle on Oct 12, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions
6 solo
and 8 total but not sure how many opportunities were there as it was against Arizona who doesn’t rush a whole lot but Warner does like to throw the ball a lot & their receivers seem to get open a lot.
I watched Pollard through the Texans game and he still plays the same...
on another terrible defense. He gets a lot of opportunities to make tackles but he whiffed bad on a few that sprung for huge plays.
The question becomes do you want a young bad SS or do you want a slightly older bad SS
pick your poison
by butchcassidy on Oct 12, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions
given that choice, I'll take the young kid who hits hard and coach him up!
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisiton!
I watched Pollard For Years and he was Over-rated
Every game I would watch Pollard be slow in coverage and come up looking for the big hit with his shoulder pads, not wrap up and let the runner bounce off of him and trot down the field. Every week I would tell my brother “watch Pollard this game ,just focus on him being out of position and two steps slow getting over to help the corner”. Every week he would pull that crap. I’m not saying I’m in love with Mike Brown but aside from the two Austin catch and runs I think you can say that he has been an upgrade with sure tackling.
Pollard was overrated.
by Ryan in Nixa on Oct 12, 2009 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions
And Brown has brrn an upgrade?
If you are going to have a safety taking terrible angles and whiffing on tackles, he might as well be young, durable and some upside instead of old, brittle and declining.
Upside? Upside is something you have in your 2nd season
Pollard is what he is, he certainly isnt going to be any faster as he ages and his techniques are poor. In case you missed it, he might have led the Texans in tackles yesterday but they got shredded through the air.
I’m not defending Brown, I’m saying don’t shed any tears over Pollard’s absence.
by Ryan in Nixa on Oct 12, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Brown appears questionable
Even watching Brown on the 3rd Q Choice touchdown run, Brown might be mailing it in on some downs.
Brown's lack of speed shows up in space.
What few seem to be noticing are the other things he’s doing very very well. He’s miles (ouch! That word still hurts!) ahead of Pollard on the mental and team aspects of the game. And the D plays better as a team with him in there, imo. He’s more under control tackling in space than Pollard was. Pollard usually had his ears pinned back and wanted to get there FAST and disrupt, which looks a lot like going for the big hit rather than the tackle to most folks.
What Brown hasn’t done, either by athleticism or anticipation, is make a timely play on ANY passes, and he’s pretty much been beaten every time he’s had to cover ANYbody straight up, which was my FIRST gripe against Pollard when I first watched HIM play. 5 games into the season, Brown has 32 tackles (on pace for 100+ on the season) and ZERO passes defensed. Both signs of a poor defense, btw.
But keep in mind that this is a set of D-backs that, just by DB X lining up opposite WR Y tells the QB and WR WAY too much about what will work, and there’s an awful lot that will work against this DB corps. This is the position group NObody was worried about except stagdsp and me during the offseason.
No question. Otis Taylor should be in the Hall of Fame.
Poor Tackling?
I think the Chiefs have gotten much better at tackling. It seems where they’re getting burned is that their secondary is too slow and theyr’e getting to plays 2 steps too late. On most big plays Austin broke free from, a corner or safety got burned and ended up trying to swat the ball away while playing “catch up” with the receiver.
We don’t need to discipline on better tackling. We need better play from our nickel backs and faster safeties.
I'm with Jon this time
I don’t think the tackling has been that big of an issue…
it just looks that way because Page, Leggett, Brown and Washington have whiffed over the last few games.
They are trying to make a play on the ball, and losing the receiver.
OR they are just getting lost by the receiver in coverage
either way, the Pass coverage is a major issue
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
Overall, that may be true but, average players are breaking tackles for game winning scores consistelntly against us.
Nicks last week, Austin this week, Choice this week Deshaun jackson in Philly. This has been going on for years now. I will agree that our tackling has improved…until the game is on the line and our DBs are letting guys get free on us to win the games. if the tackling is as good in the 4th quarter as it has been in the 1st quarter, this team will be fine. if not, we are going to keep losing these heartbreakers until it is fixed.
What really pisses me off is that we aren’t getting beat by superstar players. These are all average NFL players who are making our defense look like keystone cops.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Oct 12, 2009 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions
Against average players
As an example, watch the Chiefs’ secondary on the Choice TD run in the 3rd quarter (about 2:10 in the video). See if you don’t agree with Chiefsfan1970. The Dallas line does their job of blocking, but Brown (30) and Page (44) appear questionable. Page apparently could had him at the 25 yard line, but decided to chase him instead.
First things first
Our defensive secondary is in bad shape
Welcome to Chiefs REBUILD - Version 2.0 /The Clark Hunt Edition
Chiefs will be lucky to go 4-12 in 2010
by KansasCityShuffle on Oct 12, 2009 11:39 AM CDT reply actions
wasn't that supposed to be the strength of this team???
It seems like the secondary has digressed.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Oct 12, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions
absolutely
they all look lost in coverage, except for Carr and Flowers.
Page, Leggett, Brown, Washington, McGraw, Morgan…
Carr and Flowers get beat from time to time, but all CB get beat sometimes.
The others don’t seem to be in the right position to cover a receiver… ever.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
You mean 'regress'
And that it has.
But I’ll digress
Welcome to Chiefs REBUILD - Version 2.0 /The Clark Hunt Edition
Chiefs will be lucky to go 4-12 in 2010
by KansasCityShuffle on Oct 12, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions
interesting that you pick a picture of Leggett for the story...
hmm…
Leggett has personally cost this team a couple games this year.
I had high hopes for him… not sure what’s going on back there
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
He has also kept on us in a few games with his special teams play
by groundedchevy on Oct 12, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions
so... keep him on special teams then?
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
He is still a very good special teams player
Terrance Copper too, it seemed like he was in almost every special teams tackle.
RIP Bodhi - Not tragic to die doing what you love. You want the ultimate thrill, you gotta be willing to pay the ultimate price.
by craig in calgary on Oct 12, 2009 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
It killed me that Leggett was out of position on both big plays that austin made and he more important “Left his Feet” and dove completly taking himself out of the play. What should have been a mild pickup was a game changer. Additionally, Mike Brown was out of position and could not make the play.
The pass rush or lack there of is still giving our secondary fits and they are not our strength. BENCH LEGGETT!
I am really questioning the Pollard release right now!
by casselreadychiefs on Oct 12, 2009 12:05 PM CDT reply actions
If the Pollard release gets us Eric Berry or Taylor Mays I'm all for it.
Though I assume we’ll draft a D or O linemen before we draft a game-changer at safety, sadly.
Who else is looking forward to the draft already? Who knows, maybe we’ll win 9 of the next 11 and finish 9-7 and go to the playoffs…right.
by DCJayhawk57 on Oct 12, 2009 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm looking forward to the draft as well...more than the rest of the season :(
And I also hope we end up picking Berry or Mays. An elite safety would have killed both of those 60 yard runs by Austin after 10 yards or less.
As disappointed as I am in this season, I have to say that I think the team is going in the right direction. We are staying in games against the best in the NFL, without having to resort to a Mickey Mouse offensive system. Other than the Philly game, I think we’ve been competitive in every game, and we should only get better as the season progresses. The team is making frustrating mistakes, but we have to try to keep in mind that it’s still in transition….a lot of the guys still have to think rather than just react. Our corners are already good, and they are only going to get better. Dorsey is much improved over last season & he’ll continue to get better…Jackson should get better through this season and into next year. NT isn’t a strength, and that’s probably going to be a problem for the D. Hali is ok, though I think he’s a stopgap solution – we need a true pass rushing LB. Mays seems to be improving, Belcher has been a nice find…neither may be the long term solution, but they are great for depth (and may yet prove to be solid starters). On offense I’d say we are in good shape, other than the obvious need for multiple quality O-Linemen. We also need a new primary RB, though I think LJ would be serviceable for a couple more seasons if the OL was fixed. For me the biggest concern right now is keeping Cassel of of IR through the remaining 11 games.
by jmcgoblue on Oct 12, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
LJ serviceable?
LMAO! From what I saw yesterday, LJ needs to find his BALLS and run like he used to. He looks like he lost his agression, and that chip on his shoulder that he used to have. I really hope they address this soon or in the draft or free agency next year. Charles could be very good as a speed back, but I do not trust him with the ball. As you said though, until we get an O-line that can block, we will see a lot more dismal games from the offense. We also need to scrap that damn 3-4 hybrid scheme. We simply do not have the talent for it, at least not yet. Cassel showed some signs of being a good QB, but he can not show it as much as we like since he is always ending up on his butt when he tries to pass. He needs more then 2 seconds to find a reciever and throw the ball. Another thing is the play calling to start the game. Doing 2 gimmick plays in the first possesion is about stupid. If you want the QB to build some confidence, you need to show that you believe in him from the start of the game. Has anyone heard if we will have Albert and Goff for next week? If not, I can see the team adding another lineman from either the practice squad or free agency. It sucks for me that I have only been able to see the last 2 games, because I live out of state. But then again, I am not able to se the futility of our team. :-(
Regarding LJ
I agree that he’s not close to being the RB he was a few years ago, but he’s still good enough to hold the position for another season or two while greater needs are addressed. If we had 3 first round picks & 12 overall then I’d say yeah, lets go draft his replacement now…in the absence of that I’ll stick with him for a couple more years & use the top picks to shore up the OL & D.
he’s"He's good enough to hold the position for another season or two while greater needs are addressed.
I disagree with that big time. I don’t think I can take another whole season or 2 of 2 YPC. I’m ready to see what one of the young guys can do. Savage and Charles both seem to be better options at this point. LJ can be used as a 3rd down RB but, that’s about it.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Oct 12, 2009 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions
It's all about having to make choices
If we can get a RB in the mid rounds or later & he turns out to be Brandon Jacobs then I’m fine with dropping LJ. I’m just not fine with spending a pick before the 4th round of this draft on a RB when he won’t do any better than LJ because he’ll have a DL or LB close enough to shake his hand as soon as he gets the ball.
there’s a run-on for you!
concern?
Fact: all corners get beat. It happens from time to time.Where is the safety help? What concerns me is when your O-tackles keep getting beat around the corners and your coach doesn’t adjust, or, you run LJ up the gut 12 times and get 15 yards.
Exactly
Which is why I don’t understand all the love for Pollard. Yeah he is a big hitter, so what? His primary job (as a SAFETY) is to keep those big plays from happening. If he’s known for whiffing on tackles (as Pollard was known to do), then he’s a failure at his position.
I have no love for Pollard...
but I still think it was a poor move. Brown has been terrible, and even if you think Brown is better, Pollard should have been kept for depth at this position, and for his good special teams play. I don’t think he is a great safety, but I also do not think there are 53 better players on the Chiefs right now.
NO BALLS LJ!!!
He needs to run harder! Period! And not go down when somebody touches him!
Yes!
Where is Donnie Edwards lol! I know we run the 3-4 hybrid, but the team did so little in free agency to help the defense. There where several good 3-4 linebackers and d-lineman available and we did nothing with them. I know that they may have wanted to play for a winner, but if you pay them right, they will come play for us.
I'd rather have Okung than Berry...
…Get a center move Albert to RG (no disrespect to his ability to play LT but if you’re paying Okung LT money play him there) let O’Callaghan develop at RT with a later pick there and a vet free agent. If you protect Cassel you can compete.
O'Callaghan will be!
I think he will be one of our best pick ups this year in the long run. He has talent and the size to be a very good RT. I dont think they will move Albert, they have spent to much money and time on him. I just do not understand why you would not have all of your lineman dressed for a game.
I'd rather have Berry/Mays
then, draft Kris O’Dowd, C, USC in the 2nd or 3rd, wherever he falls.
Albert, Waters, O’Dowd, Ndukwe, O’Callaghan would be a solid line for 2010.
Develop/acquire another T, and another G, and now you’re building something.
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
If they dont' take Okung in the 1st or O'Dowd in the 2nd...
Jason Fox, T, Miami
Mike Pouncey, G, Florida
are projected to be there with the Chiefs second 2nd round pick…
Lee Ziemba, OT, Auburn
Matt Tennant, C, Boston College
should be there when the Chiefs pick in the 3rd round
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
I really miss Wigemann!
I know he wasn’t the best center. But damn he gaves us stability. Since he left, we have had nothing but problems at center> Herm screwed this team up and I bet it will take at least the rest of this yr and probably next to build our talent back up to a respectable level.
we could have had that this yr but the draft was 75-80 a waste
instead of getting T Jackson DE R1 pick 3/we could have had M Oher OT R1 pick 23
R3 pick 3 alex magee DT/ we could have had louis vasquez OG R3 pick 14
R4 pick 2 Donald Washington CB/ we could have had Jonathan Luigs C R4 pick 6
by Bestofthewest on Oct 12, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions
coulda woulda shoulda but didn't
insert dead horse picture here
obviously, the Chiefs needed DL and CB as well as OL…
* "I doubt anyone will miss Connor Barth except UCrawford"
* the LB corps may become the biggest strength of the Chiefs in 2009
* The OL is NOT as bad as you think it is... give it time, and you'll see improvement this season
Yeah i understand the dead horse picture comment but
maybe we are all giving too much credit to pioli,even they didnt do anything with the offense thats really meaningful,other than succop all the off. players are nobodys.Those 3 i listed are all starters for theirs teams.Maybe pioli and haley arent the genious duo they are made out to be.
I think they arent the evaluators of talent we hoped they would be, look at the line we started with.
We will just have to wait this horrible yr out and see what happens next yr.
by Bestofthewest on Oct 12, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions
I have a theory about that.
I actually think that the reason they thought our O-line would be okay this year is because they were practicing against our young, crappy D-line everyday. If our defense was better, they would be able to properly gauge the talent on offense and vice-versa.
by Chiefsfan1970 on Oct 12, 2009 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions
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