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Dead Man Walking: The Chiefs' 2009 Head Coaching Candidates...So Far

Most_interesting_man_tiny by UCrawford on Comment 217 comments

From the FanPosts. -Chris

As the tenure for head coach Herm Edwards likely winds down to its final days, or even hours (hence the title) some names have surfaced to be the new Chiefs' head coach for the 2009 season and some have been eliminated.

Per the Kansas City Star, Kirk Ferentz, whose Hawkeye team won their first bowl game since 2005, would appear to be out:

Pioli has worked with University of Iowa coach Kirk Ferentz, who has been rumored to be one of Pioli’s top coaching candidates. Ferentz has been telling those close to him that he will be staying at Iowa.

Per Pro Football Talk, so is Titans defensive coordinator Jim Schwartz:

In response to a suggestion in some circles that new Chiefs G.M. Scott Pioli might pursue Titans defensive coordinator Jim Schwartz to become the new head coach of the team, a league source tells us that it will not be happening.

Per the source, Pioli and Schwartz "despise each other."

Giants defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo appears to be very much in the mix, although he also appears to be the hottest candidate currently on the market with Denver already signing Josh McDaniels, so the Chiefs will have some competition for his services from the Lions (who appear to be favoring Schwartz right now) and the Rams (who will interview Spagnuolo this week).

Rex Ryan, the defensive coordinator for the Ravens has been a name floated among Chiefs fans, but currently he appears to be headed for the New York Jets to replace Eric Mangini.

As for our current coaching staff, it would appear that they're already looking for new homes, per the Star:

Meanwhile, there are signs that Edwards’ staff is beginning to scatter. Special-teams coach Mike Priefer was given permission to interview with Denver and Green Bay. Secondary coach David Gibbs recently interviewed with Houston.

Can't say as the thought of Mike Priefer coaching against us with Denver is going to make me exceptionally unhappy.  I half suspect that his first order of business will be to have Matt Prater compete for his job against Nick Novak to see if Denver needs to upgrade their "veteran leadership" on special teams.

 

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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Ferentz

I was leaning towards him earlier (during the Pioli hire discussions) but I have to confirm that after hearing some comments from the media, he’s not leaving Iowa. It’s been suggested that Ferentz would go to another college team before even considering the NFL.
So I think he’s out.

As far as Spagnuolo, considering Pioli’s and his relationship (boy’s club), I think we’d have a leg up on the competition and he should be considered the leading candidate.

610 reported this a.m. that the news conference today would address the HC question. I don’t think it’s meant to indicate that there is a decision in place (speculation on my part), just that the HC question would be addressed.

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 8:50 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I like me some Spagnuolo

Just to have a coach I can refer to as “Spags”

Actually, for the total package he’s my first choice.

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 8:53 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Heard on ESPN Radio

Heard on ESPN Radio
That the NY Giants may not let Spag go in the end. They feel he is valuable to their team. They may be considering naming him the heir apparent to Coughlin when he decides to step down. Make him an assistant head coach and pay him more money could preclude him from interviewing with other teams. Because the NFL rules state that it can’t be a lateral move from one team to another. Just what I heard I don’t know if the Giants will actually do that in the end.

by ksjhwk on Jan 14, 2009 10:43 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wouldn't he have to accept that deal?

I would assume they couldn’t alter his contract without his agreement – which means if he takes it he’d rather stay in NY anyway. I’m biased (everybody thinks their team is the best job) but I would think joining the hotshot GM and younger, loyal ownership would be more tempting than waiting on Coughlin to retire. Personally, I think hot prospect coaches are dumb to sign on to these “Coach in waiting” deals. They’re insulting to the current coach and inhibiting to the heir apparent imho. It’s not like college football where “continuity” can help lure recruits.

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 10:50 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

AND that don’t usually work either. Al Saunders was suppose to be the heir apparent to Dick Vermiel and it didn’t happen. Greg Williams was suppose to be the heir apparent to Joe Gibbs and it didn’t happen.

by ksjhwk on Jan 14, 2009 10:52 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

sorry I didnt see what you said

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 12:13 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But yeah

I’ve heard similar things

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 10:51 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thats not always air tight

I think it was Al Saunders who was given something similar to that under Vermeil here, and when Vermeil bolted so did Saunders. ( I don’t think Carl even considered him)

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 12:12 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nice post

Spagnuolo apparently doesn’t interview well. I know many times an interview means jack squat but you gotta take note when a couple of different clubs have been less than impressed with Spagnuolo after interviewing him. Maybe it’s a personality thing, I don’t know. But that worries me a little bit.

by primetime 07 on Jan 14, 2009 8:53 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Interesting

I didn’t realize he was interview challenged. I like his approach and his system seems to fit our guys pretty well. I’ve been high on him but if he’s some kind of drip, I’d be concerned about that as well.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 10:15 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Call me crazy,

I still like the idea of Shanahan. I know we got the top person we wanted for GM, but I want a coach who has been there, and done that. I want an offense minded HC, who will not meddle with defense.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 8:54 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That might be a viable option

According to some analysts Pioli is going to hire a HC with NFL experience. It might be a former HC, O or D coordinator…but someone with Pro Football experience.

I think he has a short list and I wouldn’t be surprised if Shannahan is on it. I jsut don’t know how “well” they know each other and whether they have the same thinking. It’s also based on whether their personalities would work well together…

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 9:00 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There would also be the Gailey, Shanahan connection.

That would open the door for Gailey to stay, with an offense minded HC, TALK ABOUT WHIPPING UP A GAME PLAN!

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:07 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Did not mean to yell there!

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:08 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I attributed it to excitement :)

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 9:09 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes Sir!

Think I need to pull a Howie Mandell, and go have my heart rate checked!

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:10 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Who runs our defense then?

With Shanahan as HC and Gailey as OC, we need a DC strong enough to tell Shanahan to go to hell, or our defense will remain sucky like Denver’s.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 9:14 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Raid the Eagles staff

it worked out well for the Giants.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:15 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Fuck it, make it an all star cast

Marty Schottenheimer!(spelling?)

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:16 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that sounds about right

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 9:17 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't care if the HC is Walsh and Stram is his assistant

and they have a seance before every play putting the calls to the QB or the LB. Let Pioli make the call.

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 9:21 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good call

We hired Pioli for a reason, to turn this team around. The last thing we should do is undermine his first major decision by not going for the coach he wants.

by Chiefs4Life on Jan 14, 2009 10:25 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Jim Haslett?

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:20 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Didn't we have that?

Wasn’t Vermeil that offense-minded HC? Sure we had some exciting games, but no D. I don’t want another round of watching other teams role all over us, even if we do put up 30 plus points a game. What’s the point of high scoring if our opponents score just that much more?

by Eastcoastransplant on Jan 14, 2009 12:39 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What is the point of stopping

Someone, then not be able to score points.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 1:03 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's worked pretty well for the Ravens so far

=)

Worked pretty well for the Titans in the regular season too

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 1:09 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My daughters didn't like

what I cooked for supper last night so they opened up a can of Chef Boy-ar-dee Spagnuolos and ate the whole thing.

by G.L. on Jan 14, 2009 9:11 AM CST reply reply actions actions   1 recs

What a load of B.S. regarding Schwartz and Pioli “despising each other”. Where is the proof? I heard that they were buds. PFT is a joke.

by augmental on Jan 14, 2009 9:13 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I still think ...

… we’re going to let Herm finish out his contract and then make a play for Cowher during the next off-season.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 9:18 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why?

Coaches aren’t placeholders in the NFL. The consequences of keeping him in a lame duck year could be bad.

by primetime 07 on Jan 14, 2009 9:22 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yup

What free agent would want to come here, when they could be cut next season.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:25 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You've been listnening to 810 :)

Agreed. Why step back a year? There isn’t a guarantee that Cowher WANTS to coach the year after.

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 9:25 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Is that what they are talking about?

I actually put on my big boy pants, and thought of that all on my own!:)

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:31 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Me to.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:52 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

810 man myself

Like their in-town shows better and I can’t tolerate Jim Rome

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 10:05 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why not?

The consequences of not letting him finish what he came here to do (ie: completing the re-build) could be equally bad.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 9:42 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He Went 2-14

And the team’s gone backwards every season he’s been in charge. The “consequences of not letting him finish what he came here to do” would appear to be avoiding an 0-16 season.

And by the way, he did not come here to rebuild the team in 2006, so let’s drop that line of bullshit right now. He came here because he thought it was a playoff team and because he needed a new job. The Chiefs weren’t talking about “rebuilding” until 2007, so Herm did not have some master plan when he came here that will cause apocalyptic consequences if he gets fired.

He’s a bad head coach…period. Those guys get fired all the time, and as long as the team’s got a good GM it’s usually not that tough to replace them.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 9:53 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He came here to rebuild.

You can deny it all you want, but that’s what he came here to do.

Vermeil’s 10-6 record prevented him from being able to convince Carl to do it. The playoffs the first year put it off again. The collapse in 2007 finally allowed him to be able to convince Clark Hunt that it needed to be done, and Carl still fought them on it.

He finally got to start it last year. If you don’t let him see it through, the guy who takes his place is going to scrap it all and start again, which will mean this entire season is for nothing. All of this crap that we went through? We’ll get to go through it all over again, possibly even drawing it out further.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 9:58 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bullshit

Here’s an article written about Herm’s hiring

You’ll not that the word “rebuild” does not appear anywhere in this article. Nor does Herm make any reference to a need to rebuild the team or go with a youth movement. Saying otherwise is revisionist history from Herm apologists who can’t accept that the football coach they support is terrible at his job.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 10:02 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If You'd Like To Prove Otherwise

Find any article from 2006 where Herm says the Chiefs need to rebuild the roster and go with a youth movement.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 10:03 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Absolutely

Rebuilding was an afterthough that came a year after he took the job. Why should he rebuild a team that he rode (albeit ass backwards!!) into the playoff his first year.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 10:05 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

From your article

but not Herm’s words

“With an aging but still effective offense”…
which became immediately less effective with the retirement of its stellar Left Tackle.

Just as that article contains nothing from Herm to indicate “rebuilding”, or “youth movement”, it also doesn’t contain anything where Herm says “He came here because he thought it was a playoff team”

I’m not claiming either side is right, just pointing out you have just as little direct evidence as JacinB does.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 10:21 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

In 2006 ...

The Cheifs were the planet Krypton: No one wanted to adknowledge we were about to blow up, even though all of the signs were there.

The Offensive Line, the one that’d been the best in the NFL for years, was old and crumbling. Willie Roaf retired before Herm ever got to coach a game. Our best running back, Priest Holmes, went out early in the season with a neck injury. Trent Green was already old, but he got knocked clean out fro 10 minutes in the first game of the season. Our best receiver, Eddie Kennison, was 33 years old and our next best receiver was Samie ‘No Hands’ Parker. And, our Defense was in it’s fifth year of absolute suckitude (25th, 31st, 29th, and 32nd in yards allowed BEFORE Herm got here).

It only got worse in 2007. We’d had to ride Larry Johnson so hard because of Priest being out and not wanting to rely entirely on Damon Huard for our offense that he broke down. Will Shields retired. And, Ty Law and Pat Surtain started looking like guys about two or three years past their shelf date.

Herm Edwards is not a football genius — though you won’t find any of those in the coaching pool we’ll be drawing his replacement from either. He is, however, a solid football guy who can and has built and coached playoff calibre teams.

He didn’t have a solid team when he got here, he had a team ready to implode and collapse under the weight of it’s aging ‘talent’. He’s now had precisely one year where he was given pretty much free reign to do as he saw fit and rebuild the team and he should get the chance to see it through.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:32 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Dude he has rode teams other coaches have built!

15-33 over three seasons, most of those 15 wins came from a veteran team.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:34 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The QB he was so high on, Pennington

Was drafted by Parcells.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:35 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ooh, let me call a timeout

while I challenge this questionable play.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:38 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Four playoff appearances in six years from 2001 – 2006.
Two playoff wins (2002, 2004) with teams that you can’t claim someone else built.
Won the AFC East in 2002, in the midst of the New England Patriots ‘dynasty’.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:40 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The guy is a horrible gameday manager.

Wants his schemes, hello r2-p2, Tampa cannot cover two. He is not able to adapt, he only did so this season to save his job, and it is not going to work.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:43 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He is not able to adapt, he only did so this season to save his job …

You claim he’s not able to adapt, but then say that he did this season.

Seems that the two statements can’t be concurrently true.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:45 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He only let Chan build the offense

midway through the season, he had to cause he had no depth at QB. And thast was by his own doing, to the detriment of the team, putting all his eggs in the Croy;le basket. He knew of the injury history, but had no plan b. I have been over this for three years with DJ, I am not going to WASTE another minute on a coach who will not be here.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:49 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Balogna

Chan built the offense that we saw the first part of the season.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 10:52 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Are you kidding me?

It was a carryover from the Solari experiment, it had Herms fingerprints all over it.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:54 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nope

the offense Gailey built to Croyle’s strengths was quite different from the “Solari – motioning will confuse the defense into forfeiting – Al Saunders” offense we ran in 2007.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 10:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's pretty evident

from watching the games from early 2008 and comparing the formations and plays to those from the last games of 2007.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 10:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We ran a run happy version

Hence the r2-p2 name.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 11:00 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Once Herm left the offense alone

we were able to make something happen.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 11:01 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There is still no evidence

Herm ever did anything with Gailey’s offense this year…you’re just beating up UCrawford’s straw man =)

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 12:36 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wait, What Straw Man

I’ve never claimed that Herm did anything to Gailey’s offense. He’s at fault for the playcalling as the head coach (since playcalls are ultimately his responsibility) but I’ve actually taken Herm’s side in the whole “Herm won’t let his coordinators make changes” debate.

You’re confusing my positions with someone else’s.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:41 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sure there is when it is r2-p2.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 1:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

in 2005

when Larry Johnson racked up 1700+ yards rushing in only 9 starts, there wasn’t a damn thing wrong with r2-p2…because most of the time, it was r2 – 1st down – r2.

The problem is not the offensive system…it is the gain of 1 yard per running play, leaving you with 3rd and 8.

The Falcons did well with a run heavy offense this year. So did the Titans.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 1:12 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah

And doing a good job considering how far in the minority he is.

Nice work jacin…

by primetime 07 on Jan 14, 2009 10:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Is it groundhog day?

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 11:03 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Herm

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 11:15 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The ironic thing about that picture ...

Is I can guarantee you that guy didn’t fall.

( The other ironic thing is, despite how it’s cropped, it likely took place at the bottom of the cliff looking up to where he was going, not where he was right then. )

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 11:40 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I bet you're right about the not falling

Herm will make it to a DB coach position somewhere :)

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 11:44 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly

You’re right. In 6 years he wasn’t able to build a Super Bowl team.

by primetime 07 on Jan 14, 2009 10:49 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How many guys have?

Seriously. How many guys have, in six years, built Super Bowl teams? Name ‘em. Seems like there can’t really be all that many, can there … ?

And, how many ‘great’ or even ‘good’ coaches have failed to meet the standard you’ve just set?

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:51 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I would venture to guess

The majority of Super Bowl winning coaches won in the first 6 years.

Just a guess, though.

by primetime 07 on Jan 14, 2009 10:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Over the 40+ year history?

probably

But certainly not recently

Belichick
Cowher
Coughlin

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 10:58 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

didn't Cowher make it to the Super Bowl

w/in the 6 year window? Certainly he didn’t win that appearance.

I could be wrong.

The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.

by sm7600 on Jan 14, 2009 11:09 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Umm

Win percentage of .313 with the Chiefs. Career win percentage in the bottom quarter of all-time NFL coaches with at least 50 decisions.

You are what your record says you are.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:33 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

he has a point

but you cant let herm go forward.

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 10:53 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Revisionist
No one wanted to adknowledge we were about to blow up, even though all of the signs were there.

So in other words, the Chiefs had no intention of rebuilding that team in 2006, Herm never publicly expressed any desire to rebuild before 2007 and you’re speculating that Herm wanted to rebuild in 2006 based on your desire not to see Herm fired.

That’s what you call revisionist history.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:31 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Even the article you quoted ...

Even the article you quoted acknowledged how old the team was when Herm took over. You can deny that all you want, but it’s fact. And you don’t come into a team like that without at least some inkling that you’re going to have to rebuild it and soon.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 11:38 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Like I Said

Show me where Herm stated before the 2007 season that the team needed to be rebuilt.

You keep touting Herm’s rebuilding “plan” and it’s bullshit. Herm never came in here with an agenda to rebuild…he came here because he needed a job and because Carl wanted to hire him. The “rebuilding” plan was something he only started talking about after it had all fallen apart.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:46 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He didn't need a job.

We took him from the Jets and they were pretty pissed about it at the time. Your own article says so, and even has Carl going so far as to be sure to state that he had permission from the Jets to talk to Herm.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 11:48 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Funny

Considering that if the Jets had wanted him all they had to do was shoot down the Chiefs’ trade offer because he was under contract to them and we couldn’t have acquired him.

Horseshit, in other words.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:53 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah ...

And, the reason why he wanted out of New York? They were looking at a rebuilding effort, too, but were unwilling to give him the contract extension (and pay raise) he wanted to be able to see it through.

From ESPN.com:

In his five seasons with the Jets, Edwards has compiled a 41-46 record and taken the team to the playoffs three times and won one division title. His salary, about $2 million per year, ranks in the bottom quadrant of head coaches. Facing a major rebuilding program, it is believed Edwards has sought a salary increase and possibly a contract extension.

He got the same rebuilding project with the Chiefs, but also got an organization he was thinking would be on-board for actually, you know, rebuilding.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:15 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again
He got the same rebuilding project with the Chiefs, but also got an organization he was thinking would be on-board for actually, you know, rebuilding.

Where did he ever say in 2006 that he planned to rebuild? Where? Show the quote to me where he said he planned to go with a youth movement in 2006. All you’ve shown is some comment where other people noted the team was aging…you’ve never shown any proof that Herm came in here with a plan to rebuild. Probably because he never had any such plan when he took this job…it’s more likely that he thought he’d lucked into running a playoff team.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:21 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

the media called it "backing into the playoffs"

I think it made an “ass” out of Herm, no pun intended :)

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 3:26 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He may not have needed a job but

His actions in taking the KC were out of desperation to get the hell out of NY. He didn’t look at what he was jumping into. He just jumped and NY even gave him a shove when they took the trade.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 12:05 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Herm had a veteran team in 2006

He he had pieces in place to make a run. They just didn’t expect to loose Roaf the way they did and Trent to be done the first game of the season. I don’t think he had any intention of tearing this team apart until that was the only choice.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 11:41 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let me reiterate:

You don’t take over a team filled with guys as old and as on the downhill side of their careers as the Chiefs were in 2006 and not expect to rebuild that team within the first year or two of your time as coach.

What Herm likely didn’t expect was all of the resistance from Carl Peterson, who thought it better to replace old and retiring veterans with veterans who were almost as old and should’ve retired rather than signing here.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 11:45 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again

That’s what you’re speculating Herm thought because you don’t want to see Herm fired. Herm never claimed during the 2006 season that his team needed to be rebuilt. So the idea that he had some master plan to go young is b.s.

What Herm likely didn’t expect was all of the resistance from Carl Peterson

Which you’re speculating based on a desire not to see Herm fired. Herm himself never claimed that he planned to rebuild prior to the 2007 season.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:49 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And, speaking of horseshit ...
Herm never claimed during the 2006 season that his team needed to be rebuilt.

Let’s take a look at the KC Star, huh … ?

After he took the Chiefs job in 2006, Edwards told his new boss that he wanted to purge Kansas City’s roster and rebuild it with young players. That wasn’t the way it had been done under Marty Schottenheimer, Gunther Cunningham and Dick Vermeil, and Edwards faced resistance from Peterson that first offseason.

Edwards waited. The Chiefs made the playoffs in Edwards’ first season, and some high-ranking team officials have said that was the worst thing that could have happened in what would become a tug-of-war between Edwards and Peterson over the next two seasons.

"I was always under the impression that they were friends; that’s why (Edwards) was there in the first place," says Gil Brandt, a longtime NFL personnel man who describes himself as a friend of Peterson’s. "Then, all of a sudden, it was like (Peterson) wore out his welcome."

Edwards went to Peterson again after that playoff appearance and presented his case to rebuild. Peterson declined, saying he thought the Chiefs might have one more playoff appearance in them before a rebuilding project would suspend Kansas City’s postseason hopes.

Then the Chiefs went 4-12 last year, and Edwards had had enough. He had been speaking with Hunt about an overhaul, and Hunt was on board. Edwards couldn’t get Peterson’s blessing, so he got the blessing of the only man in the organization more powerful than the Chiefs’ president/general manager/CEO.

"Clark," Edwards said late Monday, "he believes in that."

Peterson’s mistake was that he continued to resist Edwards’ plan. Hunt had adopted the notion of rebuilding as the right way, but Peterson kept prodding Edwards to shelve the destruction — at least in the complete manner Edwards had suggested.

Weird. Looks like you’re wrong and I’m not revising anything.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 11:59 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And the blockquote feature fails me again ...
After he took the Chiefs job in 2006, Edwards told his new boss that he wanted to purge Kansas City’s roster and rebuild it with young players. That wasn’t the way it had been done under Marty Schottenheimer, Gunther Cunningham and Dick Vermeil, and Edwards faced resistance from Peterson that first offseason.

Edwards waited. The Chiefs made the playoffs in Edwards’ first season, and some high-ranking team officials have said that was the worst thing that could have happened in what would become a tug-of-war between Edwards and Peterson over the next two seasons.

“I was always under the impression that they were friends; that’s why (Edwards) was there in the first place,” says Gil Brandt, a longtime NFL personnel man who describes himself as a friend of Peterson’s. “Then, all of a sudden, it was like (Peterson) wore out his welcome.”

Edwards went to Peterson again after that playoff appearance and presented his case to rebuild. Peterson declined, saying he thought the Chiefs might have one more playoff appearance in them before a rebuilding project would suspend Kansas City’s postseason hopes.

Then the Chiefs went 4-12 last year, and Edwards had had enough. He had been speaking with Hunt about an overhaul, and Hunt was on board. Edwards couldn’t get Peterson’s blessing, so he got the blessing of the only man in the organization more powerful than the Chiefs’ president/general manager/CEO.

“Clark,” Edwards said late Monday, “he believes in that.”

Peterson’s mistake was that he continued to resist Edwards’ plan. Hunt had adopted the notion of rebuilding as the right way, but Peterson kept prodding Edwards to shelve the destruction — at least in the complete manner Edwards had suggested.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:00 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ouch

UC…that’s gotta smart :P

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 12:43 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hey...Peanut Gallery

If you want to take shots at what I’m saying perhaps you should come up with something of your own first. :)

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:31 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sourced From Where

Babb’s article is as speculative about Herm’s motivations back then as your comments are. At what point did he ever state he planned to rebuild? Who was the source that said that Herm and Carl were at each others’ throats? The only source I see cited is Gil Brandt, who was repeating essentially third-hand information or speculated on what he thought might have gone down.

The idea that the Chiefs were planning to rebuild when Herm was hired in 2006 is myth. Herm never stated such a plan publicly and even if the defense of Herm was true (that he wanted to rebuild but Peterson wasn’t on board) then obviously there was no commitment to rebuild in place when Herm was hired, because his boss wasn’t interested, so the real push to rebuild was only done after the Chiefs tanked the 2007 season.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:29 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why don't you guys start talking about important stuff...

…that’ll impact the success of the franchise for 2009? The Cheerleaders :)

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 1:35 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Show More Skin

Those uniforms they wear now don’t get me up enough for the games…if you know what I’m saying. :)

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:42 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Early start times for games after late nights

…I get it ;)

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 1:56 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Because he's a professional.

Herm didn’t talk about it to outside sources because he’s a professional.

He didn’t bitch about it in news conferences because he’s a professional.

He didn’t cry about it to the news media and let stories slip out because he’s a professional.

He took his concerns to his boss. Repeatedly. And when it was clear that his boss was going to be an impediment and refuse to do the things that needed to be done to make this team everything that it could be, he took it to his boss’ boss.

And, only after his boss got fired for his obstinance and hard-headedness did we start to see stories — which contain quotes from people both within the organization and close to the people involved — that tell us what had been going on behind the scenes that Herm didn’t make public because he’s a professional.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 2:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Unsubstantiated
Herm didn’t talk about it to outside sources because he’s a professional.

Or because it never happened.

He didn’t bitch about it in news conferences because he’s a professional.

Or because he wasn’t really that dedicated to rebuilding until he had no other choice.

He didn’t cry about it to the news media and let stories slip out because he’s a professional.

Or because he generally hated talking to reporters or giving away info that might put blame back on him for his team’s performance.

He took his concerns to his boss. Repeatedly.

Say a lot of people with no first-hand knowledge of such conversations, based off of questionable sources…sources that were often false if we believe Carl Peterson’s final press conference.

And when it was clear that his boss was going to be an impediment and refuse to do the things that needed to be done to make this team everything that it could be, he took it to his boss’ boss.

Who has not given any indication that Herm Edwards will be the head coach in 2009 since hiring Scott Pioli.

And, only after his boss got fired for his obstinance and hard-headedness did we start to see stories — which contain quotes from people both within the organization and close to the people involved — that tell us what had been going on behind the scenes that Herm didn’t make public because he’s a professional.

Which were just as speculative and questionably sourced as the stories of discontent from before Peterson was fired.

Frankly, I don’t care if Herm liked Carl or Herm hated Carl or Herm and Carl loved or hated each other…all I care about is the results on the field, and they both did a shitty job of fielding a team. Herm should have lost his job based solely on going with Brodie Croyle as his starting QB as far as I’m concerned…no other decision demonstrates his incompetence as a head coach in football more clearly than that one. Peterson deserved to get canned because he presided over way too many years of futility in the draft and free agency and it was just time for him to go.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 2:34 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

-1

I’ve been reading this sparring match and you were actually getting a bit convincing with that article you found – although I have to agree that the article is pure speculation. It was written in 2008 from a third party. There are no on the record statements from Herm circa 2006 confirming he wanted to rebuild. — but this was just over the top and completely undermined your argument. Claiming professionalism in his dealings with the media could not be more wrong.… lest you forget that his inability to be accountable and accept any wrong doing is perhaps the BIGGEST REASON EVERYONE IS CALLING FOR HIS HEAD. Sorry, didn’t mean to yell. Y’know, the biggest reason besides 22 losses in 25 games, poor clock management, aversion to technology… I could go on.

by KCScuba on Jan 14, 2009 2:44 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If You Want To Avoid Yelling

It pays to just put the part you’re trying to highlight in italics (or bold, like you did). Has the same effect.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 3:14 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I didn't sincerely mean to avoid yelling.

That was an attempt at civility. Was more going for the… "we got no food, we got no job, we have the worst coach in the NFL AND HE’S GOING TO BE RETAINED.

by KCScuba on Jan 14, 2009 3:25 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I Wasn't Ripping On You

It was just a tip. Got your intent…just saying that italics generally achieves the same effect without the obnoxiousness of ALL CAPS.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 3:40 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

They never intended to overhaul this team

They originally were going to get new players as they needed them. I guess you rebuild a team with players like Ty Law, Alphonso Boone, Donnie Edwards, Damion Macintosh, Napoleon Harris. Kyle Turley, and Michael Bennett.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 11:51 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Which is ...

… a remnant of Carl’s philosophy, not Herm’s.

Pretty sure I outlined that already in the second paragraph of the response you’re supposedly responding to but apparently didn’t read.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 11:53 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So....

Herm comes to a team who went 10-6 the year before he arrives just missing the playoffs and says….“I want to blow this thing up.” Carl says “No way Herm. We are going to ride this franchise into the ground.” It is very naive to think that Herm didn’t see this as an opportunity to make the playoffs. The schedule wasn’t tough that year and looked like we had a shot at the division.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 12:01 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again ...
After he took the Chiefs job in 2006, Edwards told his new boss that he wanted to purge Kansas City’s roster and rebuild it with young players. That wasn’t the way it had been done under Marty Schottenheimer, Gunther Cunningham and Dick Vermeil, and Edwards faced resistance from Peterson that first offseason.

Ain’t me saying. It’s a guy saying it who reports on the Chiefs for a living and has some pretty extensive contacts from within the organization.

You can deny it if you’d like, but you’re the guys basing your information on speculation. I’m basing my information on a source who would know.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess you read the star as well

Got any quotes from anyone besides Herm?

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 12:19 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah ...

Read the article.

It’s got one of Carl’s friends, Gil Brandt, backing up the story that it was Herm vs. Carl on whether or not the team needed to rebuild and how the rebuild should be accomplished.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:23 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So Carl hires the guy

he has wanted for years and doesn’t give any reign. GO back and read the article in 2006 when he was hired. You don’t work that hard to get a coah to appose him.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 12:26 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He hadn't wanted Herm for years.

That, as UC likes to say, is revisionist.

He wanted Herm when he needed a head coach because he liked Herm. They’d been friends since way back when Carl was a college recruiter trying to get Herm to come to his school.

Herm and Carl had drastically differing ideologies on how to build the Chiefs into a playoff contender.

Carl did it by building year-by-year, hiring aging veterans and trying to plug gaps. That is what you illustrated with the list of guys you’d outlined earlier.

Herm’s idea, and the one he couldn’t get the Jets to go for, was to build through the draft. He thought, most likely because of their friendship, that he could talk Carl into it when he couldn’t convince the Jets to.

( And, you need look no farther than the Jets this past off-season to see that they’re still doing it Carl’s way — overpaying for aging veterans hoping to make a playoff run that one year. )

He couldn’t. He finally talked Clark into it when Carl continued to refuse.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:31 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

even though he got Bradway fired?

Amazing how GMs fall by the wayside where Herm is concerned…..

The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.

by sm7600 on Jan 14, 2009 1:12 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What In The Hell Are You Talking About?
He hadn’t wanted Herm for years.

Then why was Herm the only coach considered for the position? Why did Peterson trade a draft pick for him?

Herm and Carl had drastically differing ideologies on how to build the Chiefs into a playoff contender.

Then I guess Herm didn’t demonstrate very good judgment by taking the job. So why exactly should we have any faith in his judgment on rebuilding when he doesn’t even have the judgment to figure out what his boss will or won’t let him do with the team?

Herm’s idea, and the one he couldn’t get the Jets to go for, was to build through the draft.

His draft record so far has been almost identical to Carl Peterson’s…about two good players a year out of each class. So what if he wants to build through the draft if he either does a crappy job of picking out players or can’t mold them into a winning football team?

He finally talked Clark into it when Carl continued to refuse.

Again, speculative on your part…a better case could be made that Hunt firing Peterson and refusing to guarantee Herm’s return was a sign that he’d given up on both Peterson and Edwards. And that will be confirmed once Herm gets the axe.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:39 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Really here is the link that quotes Carl saying that very thing?

“From a personal standpoint, I have wanted to do this for many years,” said Peterson, president of the Chiefs since 1989. “I think the future of the Kansas City Chiefs is in exceptional hands.”
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/chiefs/2006-01-09-edwards_x.htm

Have fun…

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 3:27 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

worse than 2-14?

then we’d have to be historically bad….and would ultimately prove that Herm was groping for solutions too

The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.

by sm7600 on Jan 14, 2009 11:08 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This is quite a pissing contest going on!! Its hilarious reading it.

by ksjhwk on Jan 14, 2009 12:24 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+100

as usual with DJ or JacinB

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 12:24 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah...my matchup isn't till later

…just waiting in the wings till I get called up. I’ve come to realize that it doesn’t matter who decided what in the old administration. Herm’s going to go the way of Carl.

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 12:27 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There's a few here...not many

most are the Thigpen as QBOF fans.

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 12:47 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agree why?

I can’t see Cowher coming back to work for a GM who has total control – I can see him coming back only if he gets total control. too many cooks in the kitchen, and I see Shanahan the same way.

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 9:24 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

shanny

I can see shanny coming back although he has had full control i think he might be down for some revenge, why not i dont think its out of the question. And cower i think your right he wants total control i dont think he comes back unless he get everything his way.

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 10:09 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

herms done

no way we keep herm . scott pioli is going to go at the coaching staff with a flame thrower i dont think we get scott pioli if we wanted to keep herm he wanted full control . herm has to be fired.

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 10:07 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Doesn't Sound Logical

Why let Herm finish is contract and than bank on getting Bill Cowher. He has pulled his name out for the last two years. How do we know he won’t do the same thing next year. I say Herm is gone and Pioli should go get the best available coach out there. Why let Herm mess up this team for another year and then leave it for a new coach to clean up in 2010.

by ksjhwk on Jan 14, 2009 10:08 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I kind of think Shanahan might

go for just coaching and not worrying about the other stuff after his stay in Denver. Plus, who would be more motivated to hand Denver its own ass on a silver platter than Shanahan?

by G.L. on Jan 14, 2009 9:35 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly!

And we know he would love to stick it to the Raiders!

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:37 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Don't want him.

Dude can’t win at Arrowhead.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 9:40 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He has the last couple of years.

The exception being this year. All of a sudden Herm is going to start winning at Arrowhead?

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:45 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

3-11.

He’s got a good shot at it.

We went into the season with a bunch of young guys that came out huge some weeks (like, for example, against Denver) and then didn’t seem to come out of the locker room at all other weeks (like against the Raiders, the Titans, and the Panthers — a couple of which actually turned out to be pretty good teams this year).

The last half of the season, they were in every game (except Cinicinatti — they all seemed to be planning their off-season vacations at that point). Yeah, we lost. And we lost stupid sometimes. But, that’s what happens when you’ve got as many rookies as we had.

Keeping Herm is crucial to the continued development of our rookies.

And, it goes beyond that to bringing in up-and-comers through the draft. From the drafts before Herm got here, we’ve got 4 players still on the team. 50ish picks, and 4 of them are still on the team.

Last years draft? The one that was roundly applauded as being the best draft any team has had in the past decade? That was Herm and Kuharich finally getting to take their guys rather than Carl Peterson’s guys.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 9:54 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Who is proven from Herms' drafts?

We have a bunch of under achieving first day picks.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 9:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Glenn Dorsey wasn’t underachieving. He did well. The problem was that he was double- and triple-teamed most of the time because we didn’t have other threats that the opponents’ O-Lines needed to worry about.

Branden Albert sure as hell wasn’t underachieving.

Brandon Flowers sure as hell didn’t underachieve.

Dwayne Bowe? Yeah, he sure sucks, huh … ?

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:02 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bowe cannot ho;ld onto the ball!

Tank Tyler, Turk Mcbride, where are they? The d-backs have been solid, I will give you that. BA is a probowl tackle, if he can stay healthy.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:05 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Another thing

Giving an injury prone QB the job without making sure he was not going to be touched. Sackintosh, Adrian Jones, Rudy Niswanger, yeah them guys will protect my fragile QB.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:08 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We compare Dorsey's rookie season to Sapp's

But Sapp was benched in the second half of his rookie season. His number may have been better. The comparison isn’t a fair one.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 11:43 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The Goal Of Football Is Not To "Win" Your Draft

The goal of football is to use that draft to build a winning football team. The Chiefs used their draft to build a 2-14 team that was actually worse than the previous year’s team.

That was Herm and Kuharich finally getting to take their guys rather than Carl Peterson’s guys.

And they went 2-14 with them instead of 4-12.

And how, exactly, do you know that they were “Herm and Kuharich” guys instead of “Carl” guys? Do you work in the front office for the Chiefs? Do they tell you which are “Herm” guys and which are “Carl” guys?

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 9:57 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Look at who's still here from Carl's drafts.

The drafts before Herm got here — from 2000 to 2005 — we’ve still got: Larry Johnson (2003), Derrick Johnson (2005), Dustin Colquitt (2005), and … ?

The drafts after Herm got here — from 2006 to 2008 — we’ve still got: Tamba Hali (2006), Bernard Pollard (2006), Brodie Croyle (2006), Jeff Webb (2006), Jarrad Page (2006), Dwayne Bowe (2007), Turk McBride (2007), Tank Tyley (2007), Kolby Smith (2007), Herb Taylor (2007), Glenn Dorsey (2008), Branden Albert (2008), Brandon Flowers (2008), Jamaal Charles (2008), Brad Cottam (2008), DaJuan Morgan (2008), Will Franklin (2008), Brandon Carr (2008), Barry Richardson (2008), Kevin Robinson (2008), and Mike Merritt (2008).

And, if I’m not mistaken, most of those guys from the ‘Herm’ drafts are significant contributors and pretty damn good players.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:10 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Just cause they got to play

does not mean they are good players. Mike Merritt, when was he on the field? Barry Richardson, when? Dujuan Morgan, we already had our safeties, with some depth, shouyld have gone o-line with that pick. Tank Tyler third year, what impact? Turk McBride, hits the QB after the play is done, what other impact? Brodie Croyle, would not have been a starter anywhere else, injured more than he is on the field. Tamba, was a disappointment, NFLrecord for least sacks as a defense. Kolby Smith solid, not an every down back, same with Charles.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 10:17 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

we already had our safeties, with some depth, shouyld have gone o-line with that pick.

bad idea…Morgan may or may not work out.

But when you suck as bad as we do, you always draft the guy who is highest on your board when your name is called.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 12:47 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So If You're Saying That The Draftees From 2006-2008 Are All "Herm" Guys

Let’s look at those draft classes

2006
Tamba Hali – Has regressed every year in the league and was horrible this season.
Bernard Pollard – Solid addition at SS
Brodie Croyle – Bust
Jeff Webb – Bust. Worse WR than Samie Parker
Jarrad Page – Solid addition at FS

So 2 good players out of that draft class

2007
Dwayne Bowe – Good pick, has shown marginal improvement at WR this year
Turk McBride – ineffective the last two years, looks like a bust
Tank Tyler – ineffective the last two years, looks like a bust
Kolby Smith – under 4 yards per carry rookie year, under 3 yards per carry last year. Bust
Herb Taylor – backup who couldn’t unseat McIntosh. Fringe player

So one good player and one so-so reserve out of the 2007 draft class, along with three guys who’ve been terrible for the Chiefs, for a grand total of 2 good players out of that draft class.

Funny, but we seem to get just as many good players out of “Herm” draft classes that we do out of “Carl” draft classes. Which leads me to believe that Herm’s not any better at scouting talent than Carl was.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 10:20 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And We'll Start Rating The 2008 Draft Class

After they’ve gotten through at least part of their second season. That’s when teams usually start discarding the scrubs.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 10:22 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You suck

how dare you label Kolby-Wan a bust? =)

Seriously though, that’s a bit premature…given his, what, 6 games worth of action?

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 10:23 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He may not be a bust, but he's no Jedi

He seems like a pretty solid backup, but hasn’t shown that he can be the big show.

by Chiefs4Life on Jan 14, 2009 10:32 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

In fact

I don’t even know if he’s played at a level to earn a contract extension when his rookie one ends. I like the guy, but he has played consistently at a fifth round level.

by Chiefs4Life on Jan 14, 2009 10:44 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Given His Sub-3.0 Yards Per Carry Average

And his sub-4.0 ypc last year…bust is accurate.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:34 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And By "Bust"

I mean a guy who’s probably not good enough to keep around next year.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:34 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

IR 2 years in a row. The only two years in the league.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 11:36 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Meh.

Details, details.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 2:56 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why?

What’s wrong with Shanahan? I’d love it if Shanahan came here. Pioli and Shanahan…a perfect football marriage. :)

Seriously, though, I think we’d do pretty well if we got Shanahan. Just as long as he’s not in charge of bringing in the personnel.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 9:54 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Come on

Shanahan makes for a compelling HC candidate. If he can keep his ego in check and work well with Pioli, what’s the problem?

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 10:07 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL

I’m with you. I can’t stand that Rat Faced goon either. My vote is for Brian Billick as H.C.

by meandean on Jan 14, 2009 9:53 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Brian billick

would be sweet but he making coors lite commercials

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 10:15 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Your Dream Coaching staff.

What would be your dream coaching staff be if you had the power to pick it?

by meandean on Jan 14, 2009 10:00 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

staff

head coach belichec rex ryan d cordinator mike martz o cordinator

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 10:17 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

eewh! Martz!!!

I’d rather see al saunders back than martz.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 10:29 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

martz

martz makes chicken salad out of chicken shit . 49ers are out of their skulls to get rid of that guy .And im sure there are other canidates out there just as good but the guy just makes things happen.

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 10:59 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

True but

he has a horrible knack for trying to be the HC from the OC’s chair. MASSIVE ego problem.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 11:01 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agree

but damn when his teams are on they are on imagine martz with dbowe tony g and lj or fuck lj just charles wow he would go off.

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 11:09 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No doubt

He’s an amazing OC. If he would just be content with that he’d be my top choice without a doubt. His schemes and shifts are sic with the right personnel.

I just think most locker-rooms have enough canerous problems with spoiled rotten players. Coaches can’t afford to be a liability but I don’t see that Martz understands that. I actually wan’t surprised that Singletary nixed his ass when they annointed him.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 11:15 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agree

martz and lj antics would be stupid

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 11:47 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Annd

martz can actually groom a qb and have a guy actually take a snap under center.

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 11:00 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Some of the knocks on Shanahan are that

he coached the Broncos and Chief’s fans didn’t like him, (Who better to kick their butts?) and the fact that some folks don’t like the way Shanahan looks. Frankly who gives a rat’s behind what he looks like if he can coach? Even if you take away John Elway, Shanahan is still a winning coach. Who would be better to restore the K.C. running game than Shanahan, the master of the zone blocking scheme? Throw in a decent defensive coordinator viola’ you have winning football team with a great offense and a great defense.

by G.L. on Jan 14, 2009 10:51 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Take Away Elway...

Okay lets explore that thought further….what would Shanahans record been WITHOUT John Elway, what if he would have had some average QB?

by ksjhwk on Jan 14, 2009 10:54 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Elway

No doubt had a huge role but they had a good D and they had an incredible run game

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 11:01 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Elway was amazing

But Sanahan did pretty well with “The Snake” and Cutler. He’s shown that he can get the best from his QB’s. Jake was a head-case but he played well for Denver. Cutler is on his way to the probowl.

He’s typically competitive offensively and the guy can manage a game extremely well. With a strong GM demanding more productivity from the defense and a good DC, I don’t think any of Shanahan’s question marks matter much.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 11:07 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

elway

but there is no way they win a superbowl without elway

by sexassassin on Jan 14, 2009 11:07 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It took Cower a long time

to win a Superbowl. Imo Shanny is the best thing out there. Besides Cower’s chin is as much of an eye sore as Shanny’s Rat face.

by GHOST OF DT on Jan 14, 2009 10:54 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cowher's chin ...

… is the inspiration for the Steeler’s mascot.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 10:56 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And The Village People

Are the inspiration for the outfit. :)

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 11:38 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I used to love it when

Cowher would get mad and his jaw would jut forward with spittle flying out of his mouth! His brow would get wrinkled like a bear’s ass sewn up with a log chain! Who wouldn’ love a coach like that?

by G.L. on Jan 14, 2009 11:42 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A lot of people think Herm wanted to rebuild this team as soon as he got here.

That is false. Look at the infllux of veterans they signed up until this year. This wasn’t a full blown deal until there was no other option.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 11:54 AM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Taking the discussion down here ...

… because you’re losing it up there? Brave.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:16 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not losing anywhere.

Just trying to get more people involved for anouther perspective. Thanks for asking.

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 12:20 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"Look at the infllux of veterans they signed up until this year"

That is not evidence for your position…you have no evidence that those were Herm’s decisions.

Carl’s word carried more weight than Herm’s, especially while Lamar was still alive.

Those veteran signings may have been agreed upon by both Carl and Herm, but we can’t know for certain that Herm was onboard with them.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 12:51 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Because ... ?

They can’t see the conversation going on up there highlighted in yellow when they come back to the thread … ?

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:25 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wow.

You really love Herm. So winning 15 games in 3 years has nothing to do with coaching and it is all Peterson’s fault. Wow that is naive. Am I talking to Herm or a relative right now?

AFC West Champs in 2009? Mayyybee.

by cmpotter on Jan 14, 2009 12:27 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Within a few days

I am sure that 0.

The name Herm Edwards could be just old hearsay. So unless he stays or one of us has direct input in the discussion, we may think about concentrating on other subjects, maybe like….cheerleader uniforms?

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 12:26 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OOOH reminds me of a poll I wanted to do about that

Should we rebuild the Cheerleaders? brb.

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 12:28 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

lol

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 12:29 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Only if

there’s an AP casting couch

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 12:29 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 12:30 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Polls up :)

Bill Parcell’s: "You are what your record says you are."

Thigpen WILL NOT be the Chiefs starting QB next year IMO. He can compete for the job and should be 2nd or 3rd string.

by THE_TRUTH on Jan 14, 2009 12:41 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Just my opinion and to keep beating the horse

I’m really surprised by the number and fervor of Herm supporters on blogs, radio, mainstream sites etc. today. I think Herm is a great human being and a competent secondary coach.. That being said, regardless of the rebuilding plan I think a coach loses all benefit of the doubt when they are 6-26 over a two-season span. Teams can rebuild without ever achieving the embarrasment of a 2-14 season. I see the close losses this year as an indictment of – not a credit to – Herm as a coach. Moreover, that 2007 team went from 4-3 to 4-12: I don’t think it’s possible to argue that the team didn’t quit on their coach.

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 12:30 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And one more thing

He also thought depending on Brodie Croyle as the future at QB was a viable plan in fielding a winner

"Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football"
- John Heisman

by Maddogmag on Jan 14, 2009 12:33 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Behind a solid line ...

It might’ve been. Brodie’s a great leader with a hell of an arm. His problem isn’t that he’s a bad QB, it’s that he’s about as fragile as bone china.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:36 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Possibly

in the one game which Croyle both started AND didn’t get constant pressure from the pass rush (because Freeney was injured), he actually did pretty well.

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 12:39 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That team did.

How many of the 2007 STARTERS were back as starters in the same spots in 2008? Not many. And most of the few that were had been replaced by their rookie back-ups by mid-season when the team stopped quitting on their coach (and started losing because they were young and sloppy).

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:35 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed

It doesn’t really matter if he came in here wanting to rebuild. I don’t believe for a second that he did, Sorry JacinB, you put up a good argument but I still don’t buy it!! He’s just not a good coach. He’s not a good evaluator of talent and he’s a half-assed motivator as indicated by all of the second half let downs we had.

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 12:36 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

KEEP HIM AND

You lose the entire team and waste an entire season. What players will honestly play their hearts out for a lame duck coach. He’ll have no creditability, and the players will know that and the end of the year he is gone. You lose the entire season on Herm and you jeopordize the future of the team and delay a revamped team by a year. “New Arrowhead” Stadium will be done in 2010. You want a competitive product out there by that time so you can have the place sold out. Keeping Herm is bad for marketing and bad for business.
MY opinion is all this speculation about Herms value to the Chiefs is over rated. Pioli is going to fire him sooner than later. He can’t afford to keep him here and waste his first year as GM on a liability like Herm.

by ksjhwk on Jan 14, 2009 12:40 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Seriously?

He might not be a great coach, but he’s damn sure a good coach. You don’t take the friggin’ New York Jets to the playoffs three times (and win playoff games in two of those years) if you’re not.

His evaluation of talent is one of his strengths, not one of his weaknesses.

And, his ability to motivate a team is what had the Chiefs going into the second half (and often into the fourth quarter) with leads in 7 out of our last 9 games.

The second half letdowns were due to the fact that we had a bunch of rookie players who weren’t used to the rigors of the NFL playing over their heads for a guy who supposedly couldn’t motivate them and just wearing out and making dumb plays before the game was over. But, that’s why he had them on the field to begin with — so that the could get used to the NFL level of play and stop making ‘rookie mistakes’.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 12:41 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think he's a good coach

in an ideal situation. He seems to blend well with younger players. I think he’d be hell on wheels in the college ranks, but I just don’t think he has the skiil-set or character traits to get it done in the NFL.

I didn’t see enough of the veterans buying in whole heartedly. Sure TG is all for Herm now that he had a banner year, but that was after he demanded a trade.

Let’s face it, he inherited a good team in NY. They had some chemistry and he had something to work wih. He came to KC and inherited some talent. Unfortunately (for all of us) the talent here had a very short shelf-life and he had a tyrant of a GM that couldn’t/wouldn’t change directions.

When Herm got the chance to make his changes, he didn’t use a sound philosophy. He was way to committed to a youth movement when he should have rebuilt with a combination of draftees and free agents. It’s not like he didn’t have the draft picks or the money available to accomplish this. Had he done so, he would have done a hell of a lot better than 2-14.

A lack of veteran leadership was a big mistake. IMO, that’s a big part of evaluating talent. It’s how you build chemistry. There’s no denying we have some solid young guys, but they need examples to follow.

I think the other area where Herm’s talent evaluation skills failed him (and the Chiefs) was with his coaching staff. Other than Chan, my God what a mess of a staff!

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 12:58 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"Teams can rebuild without ever achieving the embarrasment of a 2-14 season"

most teams realize they need to start rebuilding, and do so soon enough that they still have at least one solid aspect of the game in which the veterans are aging, but still able to play at a high level…I think Peterson kept us from that for too long, so we didn’t have a rebuilding offense and an aging but still capable defense (like the Ravens this year)…we waited until both sides started falling apart and tried to rebuild all at once…

by PVChiefsfan on Jan 14, 2009 12:57 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes

So this year we had a lame-duck GM, and the Herm apologists would have us saddled with a lame-duck coach next year!!!

by Buck'O on Jan 14, 2009 1:00 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ferentz

Great arguement gentleman, I don’t have much to add, that hasn’t been said, but I don’t think it matters, b/c Herm is gone.

Now…point I want to make is, if we’re going to assume that Ferentz is staying at Iowa based on:

Pioli has worked with University of Iowa coach Kirk Ferentz, who has been rumored to be one of Pioli’s top coaching candidates. Ferentz has been telling those close to him that he will be staying at Iowa.


From the KC star?

Sorry, but I can’t trust the Star at this point to deliver ‘breaking’ news. Not with what they’ve done recently. Teicher posted a video blog YESTERDAY MORNING saying he didn’t think a hiring was imminant. They still have it up…ridiculous.

This morning I heard Mort say on Mike and Mike that he thought Ferentz was still the favorite…I think thats right.

If Ferentz wasn’t interested, he’d say so publically, and FAST. The man has to recruit, and every day there is speculation he’s leaving is a day that hurts his chances at landing a player. We’ll know something very soon on this, and I suspect he is still very much in the mix.

From what I gather, I think its his job to lose, and if he doesn’t want it, then Spags becomes the lead candidate.

by kcsno56 on Jan 14, 2009 1:47 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hmmm

Guess I screwed up the quote thing, only: “li has worked with University of Iowa coach Kirk Ferentz, who has been rumored to be one of Pioli’s top coaching candidates. Ferentz has been telling those close to him that he will be staying at Iowa.” obviously came from the Star.

by kcsno56 on Jan 14, 2009 1:48 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's A Valid Point

But I also think that he’ll wait until Pioli actually asks him if he’s interested in the job before he’ll say publicly that he’s staying in Iowa (or leaving). At this point we don’t even know if he’s been offered an interview and if he hasn’t then there’s no reason for him to be issuing any public statements.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 1:57 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Could he be taking a cue from the Boston College fallout?

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 3:34 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ESPN is reporting ...

Top of the hour SportsCenter just said that Chris Mortensen has a story that, with McDaniels going to Denver and Ferentz saying he’s intending to stay in Iowa, Pioli is likely to keep Herm Edwards as Chiefs Head Coach.

Can’t find the story on ESPN.com … yet.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 3:04 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

way to shoot ourselves in the foot

Is it possible we’re the only organization that can seize defeat from the jaws of victory this quickly?

The only measure of true success in the NFL is the Vince Lombardi trophy. Anything less is a rationalization.

by sm7600 on Jan 14, 2009 3:25 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm Not Worried About It

We were hearing the same things about Cam Cameron in Miami last year…right up until he was fired. And Cameron had a lot less reason to get canned than Herm does.

Plus, Mortensen’s really been off his game for the last couple of months.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 3:41 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ESPN's been updated.
According to ESPN’s Chris Mortensen, Pioli previously had two coaching candidates in mind: Patriots offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels and Iowa coach Kirk Ferentz.

McDaniels, hired as Broncos head coach early this week, is off the market, and it appears Ferentz is staying put at Iowa, so those are the primary reasons why Pioli could retain Edwards for next season, and reassess the situation in 2010.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 4:18 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As I Noted On The Other Thread

Pure speculation in that piece. Mortensen makes it pretty clear that it’s a “what-if” scenario he’s going over. And the Star has cited assistant coaches as saying that Herm’s probably getting fired this week, so his speculation is contradicted by more reputable sources.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 4:37 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again I love it

When JacinB finds his sources to back up EVERY post he makes but overlooks the finer points of the quote. The quote stats that Pioli COULD retain Edwards. DOES NOT say he WILL. Keep up the sources quotes JacinB I love finding holes in them.

by ksjhwk on Jan 16, 2009 1:06 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wasn't Cam 1-15?

I’d say that’s probably a ‘little more’ reason rather than a ‘lot less’ reason.

Herm Edwards is Clark Hunt's guy. Herm and Carl forced Clark to choose between their differing visions on how to rebuild the Chiefs, and we all see who got their walking papers. Herm's going to be walking the sidelines at Arrowhead in 2009, and possibly even beyond, no matter who the new General Manager is.

by JacinB on Jan 14, 2009 4:02 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2-14 nuff said.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 4:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wasn't it Cam's first season?

I’d say that’s probably a ‘little less’ reason rather than a ‘lot more’ reason.

We need a future defensive leader, his name is James Laurinaitis and he can be selected in round 1 of the upcoming Draft.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Jan 14, 2009 4:04 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes it was.

They changed front office, coaches, added some players, went 11-5, with a rookie coach.

Welcome to KC Scott Pioli, home of the most rabid football fans in the NFL!

by Eric Allen on Jan 14, 2009 4:06 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes

But he only got one season.

Although I didn’t think it was a horrible injustice for him to get fired. He was a crap head coach at Indiana too. Some people just aren’t cut out to be head coaches.

Herm Edwards will not be the Chiefs' head coach next season.

by UCrawford on Jan 14, 2009 4:35 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I like Spagnuolo

Herm is bad coach and you can dress it how you want, but his recored speaks for itself. I don’t want to lose 14 (or possible more) games next year.

Shannahan I don’t care for. Beyond my dislike for the Broncos, he seems on the downhill side of his “mastermind” career. I don’t see him as an improvement from Herm despite the fact he has a better record. I don’t see either taking us to a Superbowl.

Just my thoughts on it … I will trust in Scott whichever decision he makes.

There's always next week,,, and when we run out of weeks, there's always next year!

by Spiderwomn69 on Jan 14, 2009 4:38 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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