Should Huard be our starting QB?

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 25, 2008 2:36 PM CDT

Before anyone freaks out, let me say this "Hell no." But another rebuilding franchise has decided to go with the veteran who doesn't fit their long term plans

Out in the desert, the Cardinals are going to go with veteran Kurt Warner over youngster Matt Leinart, who had an especially bad performance against the Raiders, hitting only four of 12 p asses for 24 yards and three interceptions.

And we thought Croyle looked bad in some pre-season games? Leinart was picked 75 slots higher than Croyle in 2006, and I can't believe the Cardinals are not starting him...how in the hell do they expect their #10 overall pick to get any better holding the clipboard for Kurt Warner? I don't get it, but I am sure glad we aren't doing the same thing, and we don't have a young Top Ten draft pick QB.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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See there was thing...

I think they called it 2007.

by Official Arrowhead Pride Parade on Aug 25, 2008 2:45 PM CDT 0 recs

we aren't*

missed that. Sniffing out Croyle apologists with the misleading title? The PARADE will stand much, but not for following the Buzzsaw, we don’t need two Royalsesque franchises.

But yes, the PARADE too is pleased we have let Huard out to pasture.

by Official Arrowhead Pride Parade on Aug 25, 2008 2:51 PM CDT up 0 recs

"Sniffing out Croyle apologists with the misleading title?"

No, I just thought it would a good way to ensure that some people clicked on this fanpost =) sorry for the dishonesty…I can’t believe the Cardinals are buckling to placate some fans…they have a lot more invested in Leinart than we do in Croyle.

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 25, 2008 3:47 PM CDT up 0 recs

Great title

I was just going to come here and mention that.

It’s all about the pageviews baby.

by Chris on Aug 25, 2008 4:05 PM CDT up 0 recs

Whisenhunt denied Mortensen's report

He said nothing has changed.

by primetime 07 on Aug 25, 2008 8:55 PM CDT up 0 recs

Oh, I'm Sure They Did

Why kill Leinart’s trade potential by announcing that your QB of the future is useless? For all they know Warner could go down and then they’ll have to play Leinart. We aren’t going to hear them announce that they’ve given up on Leinart until after they’ve traded or waived him.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 11:59 PM CDT up 0 recs

The longer

Huard hangs around, the more I am afraid. Especially if Croyle craps the bed again versus the Rams. We went down this road last time. Must. Not. Let. Huard. In.

by Ridiculous Matt on Aug 25, 2008 3:23 PM CDT 0 recs

On Saturday, I almost thought so until...

Huard came in and chucked a beautiful INT that nearly went for 6. Better to let the young guns develop and see if they can work their way in to our future.

I’m gonna have to say no… no no no no hell to tha no.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 3:24 PM CDT 0 recs

and Leinart

looked like a bag of smashed assholes against the Raiders… his stock should be dropping like an anvil in the ocean.

Croyle>Leinart – at this point at least… Crizzle hasn’t thrown 3 picks in a single game.
Warner > Huard – and he has the hardware to prove it

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 3:27 PM CDT up 0 recs

Ocho... Did you ever imagine yourself typing this?

Croyle>Leinart

by sunny D on Aug 25, 2008 3:56 PM CDT up 0 recs

I Certainly Didn't

More and more I’m wondering if that NFL ad for team apparel last year wasn’t representative of Leinart’s game prep…sleeping one off in a recliner while the boss yells.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 4:16 PM CDT up 0 recs

Leinart

Leinart has to be one of the big disappointments in recent years. Just think, if he had come out as a Junior right after winning the Heisman, he would have undoubtedly been a #1 overall pick.

Just goes to show that no matter how much exposure you get or how well you play in college, the NFL is a completely different game.

by ChiefDJ on Aug 25, 2008 5:23 PM CDT up 0 recs

I Think The Big Factor

Is that you can’t screw around all week, come in unprepared on game day and expect to win in the pros like you can in college. There aren’t games in the NFL that you can take for granted as wins like there are at USC. I get the impression that Leinart hasn’t really figured that out yet, and that his coach has finally gotten sick of waiting for him to pull his head out of his ass.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see Matt Leinart go the way of Cade McNown…another outstanding college QB (also a lefty, like Leinart) who was more interested in chasing tail than being good at his job. He was only around for two or three years before the Bears got sick of his bullshit and sent him on his merry way.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 7:30 PM CDT up 0 recs

oooh... I almsot forgot about him

That’s a strikingly accurate comparison.

Leinart is still young, so maybe he can turn things around. Maybe he can learn something from Pop Warner? On the other hand, he’s already butt rich, so maybe he won’t care either way.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 8:03 PM CDT up 0 recs

Funny - and true in any profession!

You MUST come to work ready to work, no matter who you are, in the grown up world – if he can’t grow up and WORK he’ll be McNown II, the sequel lol…

by KCFanatic on Aug 25, 2008 8:05 PM CDT up 0 recs

no... and

If last year me met this year me… he would probably slap me call me a complete idiot for saying so. But it’s looking more and more like it’s true.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 7:59 PM CDT up 0 recs

Kind of a back-to-the-future thing

You got happenin’

by sunny D on Aug 25, 2008 9:00 PM CDT up 0 recs

1.21 Jiggawatts!!!

GREAT SCOTT!!!

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 9:53 PM CDT up 0 recs

A real Chiefs fan

Would get that flux capacitor up and running to (Dawson) help (Thomas) the (Alt) team (Smith) this (Lewis) year.

by sunny D on Aug 25, 2008 11:06 PM CDT up 0 recs

No

Huard should not be the starter for the Chiefs…at least not for quite awhile until Brodie’s had a chance to show that he’s either a starting NFL QB or a guy headed for the door. If Croyle absolutely sucks for the first 6 or 7 weeks, I’d say maybe Huard should start playing again, but until then it’s pointless.

Also, the reason the Cards are starting Warner is because they’re not in rebuilding mode, they’re try to compete for the playoffs this year and they need their QB position to produce now and Leinart still hasn’t demonstrated that he’s close to ready.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 3:49 PM CDT 0 recs

And I Think Leinart

Needs a change of scenery…preferably somewhere not close to L.A. and the paparazzi. Because honestly, the guy’s got the necessary tools and ability to succeed but more and more I’m questioning whether he’s got the desire and work ethic to do so.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 3:55 PM CDT up 0 recs

Bingo!

by sunny D on Aug 25, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up 0 recs

Leinart=Bust?

But, UC, don’t you think that Leinart is most likely a bust if he doesn’t start this year? He’s in his 3rd year, he was a first round draft pick, and he can’t beat out an elderly former arena league QB for the starting position…. I’ve heard you say quite often that Brodie, a 3rd round pick from the same draft, should be expected to be playing at a high level by now, does that make Leinart Bust Bound?

Not trying to be sarcastic here, and certainly not trying to start an argument, just trying to get my head around some of your points concerning Brodie – either the 3rd year is time for a high level of performance for a QB or it isn’t. Leinart started 11 games in 06 and 5 games in 07, so he has 10 starts on Brodie. It should be put up or shut up time for him, shouldn’t it?

I agree that Leinart most likely isn’t ready AND that Brodie certainly hasn’t looked significantly better, but it sounds like you are holding out more hope for Leinart then you are for Brodie sometimes =)

by KCFanatic on Aug 25, 2008 4:15 PM CDT up 0 recs

Bust Is A Fair Assessment If He Doesn't Turn It Around This Year

No worries…I think that you’re completely right.

He looked better his rookie year than he has this year, and that was a rotten team. Last year he looked terrible. This year he’s been beyond terrible. I’d thought that maybe Leinart had turned the corner from the way the coaching staff there had been talking him up (claiming that he’d been spending a lot of time working on his game) but now I suspect that was just the staff trying to put a positive spin on things and I wouldn’t be surprised if those camera shots that came out awhile ago were pretty indicative of how Leinart’s been training.

Third year is when QBs tabbed as starters should be making the leap…if they don’t it’s time to treat them like you would any other journeyman or scrub and make them earn their roster spot (or cut them loose if they fail).

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 7:38 PM CDT up 0 recs

Exactly

Leinart has always been the top dog wherever he’s gone and I think he’s having a hard time adjusting to having competition and being overmatched. I think he’s one of those guys who his whole life had things handed to him and now he doesn’t know how to handle having to work for it and probably doesn’t think he should have to.

by ChiefDJ on Aug 25, 2008 5:25 PM CDT up 0 recs

Spoiled

That’s definitely the impression I get too. The pouting about Warner getting playing time last year was what really solidified that impression for me.

I’d say that he’d be worth a shot for the Chiefs as a project, but honestly I’m not sure that would be the case. Leinart got his contract, and I’m not sure he even really cares that much about being a football player anymore.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 7:32 PM CDT up 0 recs

USC Quarterbacks

They’re always highly touted as coming out of this great pro system that prepares them for the NFL, but honestly Carson Palmer’s been the only QB who I think has justified the faith of the team that drafted him.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 7:33 PM CDT up 0 recs

I was thinking the same thing

USC is supposed to be the most NFL like system in college football, but sure seems like not very many of their players really end up making it big in the pros.

by ChiefDJ on Aug 25, 2008 7:39 PM CDT up 0 recs

I Wonder How Much Of That Is Work Ethic

It’s not like those guys don’t have the tools to do well or the opportunity. I mean, just look at Palmer…if you’re building a team and need a franchise QB he’s the kind of guy you’d be happy grabbing. If the Chiefs were able to get him now (even if he is a vet) I’d be ecstatic). But the guys that have followed him (and who preceded him) just seem to be missing something he has. Work ethic seems to be part of it. Much as I hate “intangibles” arguments, he also just seems to have more heart as well…he seems like he actually wants to play and wants to win. Leinart just seems like he’s happy being an ex-USC QB with a big NFL contract. It’s too early to judge John David Booty, of course, because he’s just a rookie.

I also can’t help but wonder if that goes back to Pete Carroll as well. When he coached in the NFL his teams were usually undisciplined and (I thought) poorly directed. In his coaching stops he’d do well at first and then it just seemed like after a couple of years the players just did their own thing and tuned him out. He was a good defensive coordinator but a pretty mediocre head coach…good instructor/weak leader would be my assessment. Maybe he’s instilling that same mindset in his guys at USC.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 7:47 PM CDT up 0 recs

My thoughts on Carroll exactly

Just look at the fit he threw about Sedrick Ellis doing the handfighting drill with Krummrie. I think he coddles his players. In college that can work out because athletic ability trumps everything else, but when you get to the pros where EVERYONE is talented, you have to be more disciplined and actually work at it. I think that is why so many of them turn out to be mediocre players in the NFL.

by ChiefDJ on Aug 25, 2008 7:57 PM CDT up 0 recs

that drill rules

and I thought that was ludicrous that Carroll freaked out about it. I would be suspicious if a player were unwilling to try to compete at that kind of level… whether instructed by the coach or not. When you’re making that kind of investment in a high potential pick like Ellis, you’d better do your due diligence to make sure he’s worth his salt.

Krumrie is the shiz.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 8:09 PM CDT up 0 recs

I Could See The Argument Against The Drill

College coaches at major programs build their reputation by sending guys to the pros (look at Dave Wannstedt…he can’t coach worth a damn, but he keeps his job by sending guys to the NFL)…the last thing you want at your pro day is some position coach in the NFL doing his own thing and injuring one of your players or hurting his draft stock with a screwy drill that may or may not have anything to do with figuring out if a guy can play. Supposedly when Chad May (former K-State QB) was doing pre-draft workouts one of the QB coaches started doing these weird stretches with his arm and popped it out of joint, which caused his draft stock to plummet. So I can understand Carroll being a little protective when it comes to unorthodox drills being used on his players that he may not see a point to (and he has coached at the NFL level after all, even if he wasn’t all that great, so he does have an idea of what should go into evaluation).

But yes, I thought Carroll came off like a whiner in how he complained.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 8:16 PM CDT up 0 recs

yeah... but

It seems more like an endurance/toughness drill than anything else. I don’t know that they could injure much more than their pride by doing it. Maybe I just like it because it’s tough-ass Krumrie doing it.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 8:24 PM CDT up 0 recs

I Found It Interesting

But then I’m also not a scout. Way I see it, I guess, is that it’s Carroll’s Pro Day and they’re Carroll’s players until someone drafts them so he’s responsible for them and if he wants to tell Krumrie to knock it off if he thinks a drill is stupid that’s his prerogative, even if it might seem petty to us.

But I still think that Carroll’s players do seem to have a predilection to being kind of undisciplined and spoiled. Although that may just be selective memory on my part. After all, Lofa Tatupu has been an outstanding linebacker, Deuce Lutui’s been solid in Arizona, and Rey Maualuga looks like he’s going to be a killer in the NFL.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 8:34 PM CDT up 0 recs

But

I wouldn’t draft a USC wide receiver if you paid me.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 8:35 PM CDT up 0 recs

Outside

of Carson Palmer, who have they really produced in the last five years? Really?

Part of that comes from the fact that being the best team in the Pac 10 is like being the best team in the NFC West.

by Ridiculous Matt on Aug 26, 2008 11:03 AM CDT up 0 recs

Just Naming The Decent Players

Lofa Tatupu, Deuce Lutui, LenDale White, Ryan Kalil, Justin Fargas, Troy Polamalu…they’ve got a lot of other guys from Pete Carroll’s tenure who are holding down roster spots (but are mainly roster filler). But still, they’ve turned out some talent…and there are a couple of guys who are young who might turn into very good players as well (Reggie Bush, Shaun Cody).

If you look at their receivers, though, that’s just an epic list of failure and underachievement. I don’t think a single USC wide receiver has been a good NFL player since Keyshawn Johnson (and he was pretty highly overrated).

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 26, 2008 11:33 AM CDT up 0 recs

Should Probably Add Sedrick Ellis To That List

And Lawrence Jackson…both of them look promising. But they’re rookies and they might turn out to be nothing in the pros.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 26, 2008 11:34 AM CDT up 0 recs

And the LB that Cincy took..

Keith Rivers… looks like he’s going to be a rock.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 26, 2008 11:39 AM CDT up 0 recs

On Madden

Keith Rivers is the new ROLB for my Chiefs franchise…with Jerod Mayo holding down the MLB spot.

Man, I love Madden’s idiotic trade engine.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 26, 2008 2:35 PM CDT up 0 recs

You should do well

with a LB corp of 1st rounders =)

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 26, 2008 3:00 PM CDT up 0 recs

being the best team in the Pac 10 is like being the best team in the NFC West.

=) Ha-Ha-Ha! However, the Cougars and Huskies take offense…

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 26, 2008 12:00 PM CDT up 0 recs

After six or seven weeks...

If they decided to put in a different QB, I’d put my money on Thiggy. But I doubt they are gonna take Croyle out, except for injury of course.

by Vince D on Aug 25, 2008 4:00 PM CDT up 0 recs

I don't think

Thigpen ever starts in the NFL as a serious contender for a long-term job.

by Chris on Aug 25, 2008 4:06 PM CDT up 0 recs

Agreed

If he ends up a long-term starter for us, it’ll be either because he’s turned himself into a Hall of Fame caliber player overnight or because we’re completely desperate and therefore screwed.

Supporting the lesser of two evils is still supporting something evil.

by UCrawford on Aug 25, 2008 4:14 PM CDT up 0 recs

I hear a lot about Savage's height

But I think Thigpen’s height is much more of a detriment and a factor at something like 6’1" for QB. If you’re built and durable at 5’8", it can be an asset to play hide and seek among the linemen and have less mass to grab for a tackle. I just get the feeling Thigpen can’t see out of a pocket. And that he won’t live long tucking the ball every other time like he does right now. He does seem to have a strong arm on the run when he finds somebody. At his point. I’d be willing to pick up John Beck and first dump Huard, but even a second new prospect as a starter if he comes along.

by sunny D on Aug 25, 2008 4:15 PM CDT up 0 recs

We shouldn't need him to be

Next year should have a glut of good QB’s going pro. If Croyle doesn’t work out, we should try to snag someone in the draft. Thigpen is likely a serviceable backup at best, unless like UC says, the lights come on and he goes berserker overnight.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 25, 2008 8:11 PM CDT up 0 recs

oh yeah

I forgot that they could go 7-9 and still make the playoffs in the Not Fantastic Conference =)

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 25, 2008 8:25 PM CDT up 0 recs

Huard - because we need to move the chains

Can’t develop the youngsters with constant three and outs. I vote for Huard, regrettably. If Lenny the Cool isn’t sold on Brodie, that’s good enough to confirm my fears. I hope I’m wrong. I had such high hopes for Brodie.

One more thing I think – I think Thigpen wouldl make more mistakes than Croyle, but we’d score more points with him.

"What the most you've ever lost on a coin toss?"

by SoCalChiefsFan on Aug 25, 2008 8:50 PM CDT 0 recs

But so would the other team's defense =)

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 25, 2008 9:07 PM CDT up 0 recs

Good line PV

But to SoCal’s point, you must be thinking that Thigpen will scramble for a few first downs, plus make a few more downfield throws. While Croyle has “learned” to be more conservative. i.e. take care of the ball, as the coaches see it. It’s an interesting balancing act, because it felt to me like Croyle teetered toward the conservative side a hair too much Saturday. Didn’t release quickly enough at times. And I’m not sure what that fade pass was that went 10 yards too far. Putting it where the defender couldn’t possibly get it? If he keeps passing like, the stadium officials will start raising the kicking nets whenever the Chiefs get in the red zone. Now THAT would be embarrassing, wouldn’t it?

by sunny D on Aug 25, 2008 11:13 PM CDT up 0 recs

On the fade

I was wondering about that as well. Looking back at the play, I think Croyle recognized that the coverage was there as soon as he started backing away from center, so he threw it away.

by PVChiefsfan on Aug 26, 2008 7:30 AM CDT up 0 recs

he should trust Bowe

He’s huge and in 1 on 1 coverage he should have an advantage on any DB in that situation. He should also know how to throw to his back shoulder where Bowe could screen out and have a better shot at the catch. It’s something he’ll learn as he grows. That’s a pass I think any elite QB would make to their top WR regardless of the perceived coverage.

by Ochophosphate on Aug 26, 2008 9:34 AM CDT up 0 recs