Jay Glazer: "Trade TG to the Giants"

by dkugler838 on Oct 10, 2008 11:50 AM CDT

The second writer in as many days to suggest trading Gonzalez. 2nd and 5th rounders? I don't know if that is such a bad deal but I would be heartbroken with it.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/8661522/These-trades-wouldn't-be-a-bad-idea

Chiefs TE Tony Gonzalez to the Giants: Why would a team trade a man many consider the greatest tight end of all time? The Chiefs are rebuilding and by the time they turn around their fortunes, Gonzalez's time in this league could be over. Why let his career end on a rebuilding team? He and team President Carl Peterson are extremely close. If they can find a trade that would work for all parties, it would actually be quite honorable for a team executive to not hold a player hostage in his final years on a rebuilding team. Get something for him to assist with the rebuilding process. He'll forever be loved in KC regardless.

The Giants are the perfect fit as they'd provide Eli Manning with one of the most reliable targets in the league. Between Gonzalez and Plaxico Burress, their red-zone threat would be downright scary. The Giants should take the second- and fifth-round picks they got for Jeremy Shockey's trade and offer them to the Chiefs for Gonzalez. Shockey for Gonzo? Who doesn't do that?

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Arrowhead Pride's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Arrowhead Pride writers or editors.

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Tony G

I sincerely doubt the organization is “Holding him hostage”. The Chiefs know they would be able to get value for him and if Tony really didn’t want to be here, I’m pretty sure he could request a trade and they would give it to him. I don’t think anyone WANTS to trade Tony, especially not the Chiefs front office, it would be a PR disaster many multitudes greater than trading Jared Allen. But if he decided he really wanted to go, I’m sure they would work something out.

Here’s the deal. Tony doesn’t WANT to go anywhere else. At least not right now. Maybe that will change this offseason. But from everything he has said this year, he wants to retire a Chief no matter what. At this point at least, that means more to Tony than going to a team that MIGHT win in the playoffs. Of course Tony has been on teams that were capable of doing that in the past and it didn’t work out.

So Tony needs to decide: Is it more important to remain loyal to the franchise you have been with your entire career where you are worshiped by the fans and retire a Chiefs? Or do you covet the opportunity to win a playoff game so much that you will give that up to go to a team that might or might now get that done?

How would he feel if he got traded to the Giants and the same thing happens there that happened in the Vermeil years? Get close but not get in, get in but lose the first game. Would he end up regretting not staying with the Chiefs then?

These are things that have to be going through his head.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 10, 2008 12:19 PM CDT 0 recs

Hmm

I wonder if Tony wanted to get that last record as a Chief first. Now that he has all the major records broken as a Chief he might start to consider this kind of option.

IF Tony wanted it and we could get a deal like that I would be all for it. I agree with DJ in that I don’t think right at this moment he is looking to be traded.

by tevans96 on Oct 10, 2008 12:27 PM CDT 0 recs

If he want's out

let him. There’s no point keeping unhappy people around. He will always be a consumate professional on and off the field. Chances are he would sign a short term deal and possibly come back to KC for his last year to retire.

However, loyalty is lost these days. People would still be upset if he was let go, and I could see people being really upset if he was let go and didn’t win the “big one,” and the draft picks the Chiefs received were not used wisely. However, I think he’s worth a little more than Shockey.

have you seen my baseball?

by IISaiNtII on Oct 10, 2008 12:50 PM CDT 0 recs

The talking heads

Were talking about it in the radio, apparently TG wants a trade or he will not finish out his contract. Talk radio does not always get everything out there, or sometimes put things out early, but what if this is the case? Oh my god we will be even worse than we are now. (Eyeballs rope, large tree branch)

by Eric Allen on Oct 10, 2008 3:48 PM CDT 0 recs

(cuts the rope and the branch)

Oh you’re not getting off that easy.

by AngryJesus on Oct 10, 2008 4:26 PM CDT up 0 recs

Damnit!:)

by Eric Allen on Oct 10, 2008 4:38 PM CDT up 0 recs

Talk Radio Guys

frequently pick up rumors off the internet and run with it. You know how reliable that is….

There’s no responsibility because what they say isn’t transcripted where you can go back and say “You said such and such right here and it wasn’t true”. So I take everything I hear on the radio with a big freaking grain of salt.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 10, 2008 5:02 PM CDT up 0 recs

Well Leon from nbc 41

Said that there are three teams interested in TG. I think it might actually happen. So the stories is gaining some steam.

by Eric Allen on Oct 10, 2008 6:24 PM CDT up 0 recs

I don't doubt teams are asking about him

But if Tony doesn’t want to go, the Chiefs aren’t going to volunteer him.

I’m not saying he won’t decide to. I for one would certainly understand if he wanted to go to a contender instead of staying with a team that will not have a chance until he is retired. But at the same time, I admire him much more for sticking with the Chiefs than turning tail and running when things get bad.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 10, 2008 7:33 PM CDT up 0 recs

I got a question

Whats the big deal with staying with one team your whole career? If it were me I would go to who ever gave me the best chance to win with the most money. Did you stay with the same company that you got hired to after college or did you move around. People put to much into loyalty, I guarantee when Tony’s skills start to go he will no be shown the same loyalty.

I say trade him because the Chiefs are not going to be good for at least two years.

by TXroyal on Oct 10, 2008 7:54 PM CDT 0 recs

It's about loyalty

I’ve stayed with jobs where things weren’t going so well and given up better paying ones out of loyalty. If you’re around a place for a long time, you feel like you own a piece of it. I have absolutely no doubts that Tony G feels like he owns a big piece of the Chiefs.

Loyal people will put up with an aweful lot because of that. Some people don’t have that trait obviously.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 10, 2008 11:07 PM CDT up 0 recs

But the difference is

a football career is only good for up to about 10-15 years given the position, some more. You may be able to work your job for 40-50 years. I am very loyal to career and community as a firefighter, but i can almost guarantee i will be gone after my 25 years is up. It doesnt mean I wont still have “the loyalty” to my job or the people I serve. I will be a fireifghter for life. (I still volunteer in my community away from the City ) Same with TG. I think he will come back and sign for the one day deal to retire a Chief.

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Oct 11, 2008 3:19 PM CDT up 0 recs

I am pretty sure

That if Tony wanted out he could get out. He has the respect of the the front office including Carl. He is the one player on the team that could ask and get a trade.

by cmpotter on Oct 10, 2008 8:58 PM CDT 0 recs

If he wants to be Ray Bourqued, then do it

But only if we get a lot back. This guy is still a star and would be a huge force for any team with a decent offense. They should have to pay a real price to add a guy like TG. More like a first rounder and a useful OL under 27 years old. (if we trade him to a contender, then their first round pick would presumably be a low one, especially after they add the best TE in the game.)

If he goes, I hope it’s to a real contending team that finally throws to him enough. KC never did, even when he caught 100 passes, he would’ve caught more if they threw more.

by Offense of the 70s on Oct 11, 2008 12:04 AM CDT 0 recs

Hmm....

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/10/10/gonzalez-to-giants/

Courtesy of PFT the best place to get news:

GONZALEZ TO GIANTS?
Posted by Mike Florio on October 10, 2008, 11:52 p.m. EDT

A reader tells us that KSHB in Kansas City is reporting that Chiefs tight end Tony Gonzalez has requested a trade, and that one of the teams in the running is the New York Gootball Fiants. (It’s an inside joke that you’ll understand only if you check the site every day, multiple times per day.)

Though we haven’t confirmed that KSHB is reporting this information, we’ve learned separately that, indeed, an effort is afoot to move Gonzalez out of Kansas City.

The trade deadline is October 14 at 4:00 p.m. EDT.

Stay tuned.

by dkugler838 on Oct 11, 2008 2:22 AM CDT 0 recs

PFT

Take that for what it’s worth. It’s a rumor site for a reason.

It’s definitely hit or miss.

by primetime 07 on Oct 11, 2008 2:57 AM CDT up 0 recs

....eh...

I can pretty much count on one hand the number of stories they have gotten wrong in the past year…

That is not to say that Tony will be traded…that is not what they are reporting after all…just saying that there is talk going on and that it is significant…

by woodman212 on Oct 11, 2008 4:14 AM CDT up 0 recs

Well

Technically he’s getting nothing wrong if it’s coming from a “league source” or reporting it as a rumor, which he does.

by primetime 07 on Oct 11, 2008 9:17 AM CDT up 0 recs

Significant

indeed. Mike Florio knows a lot of insiders in the industry and doesn’t post anything unless its confirmed from his sources. This is troubling to me because like LJ, Tony is the last guy I want to see leave the Chiefs. But if you love something you must let it go, right? He deserves whatever he wants but if he’s requesting to be traded hopefully this a bigger signal to the Hunt family that all is not well on the homefront. Remember TG originally signed on for the rebuilding movement but if he’s changing his tune (which it sounds like after the Denver game) then we may be in for a longer ride than expected in turning this franchise into a winning organization again

Without Tony & Larry this rebuilding effort becomes A LOT less attractive. I think if not by the deadline (too fast, wont happen) then Gonzalez is gonzo by next season = (

by KansasCityShuffle on Oct 11, 2008 4:29 AM CDT 0 recs

As I heard it yesterday

Tony requested the trade, if it does not happen he will not honor his contract. Things must be more dismal than we all thought. Maybe no faith in the rebuild?

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 7:23 AM CDT up 0 recs

I don't think Tony's any different than the fans

It’s easy to SAY you’re ok with the rebuild, its a lot more difficult to live with it. How many of us said we were fine with going 4-12 again, but secretly hoped we would be 8-8 or better? Tony loves the Chiefs as much or more than we do, you know he had to have the same thing going on in his head.

People keep wanting to look at this as an indictment of the coaching and stuff, but in reality, its what we all expected, but still we’re disappointed.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:21 AM CDT up 0 recs

We all figured this team

Would be competitive, to this point not really. They have shown some flashes, but that is it. Herm is showing he is too stubborn to adapt. I am sure the team has to be questioning things.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:29 AM CDT up 0 recs

That is your opinion

and you are welcome to it. All the same, he has a team of young guys that are just learning how to play in the NFL and those mistakes are contributing to the situation they are in. The team has problems no doubt, but I sincerely doubt the players are scapegoating the coaches like the fans are.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:31 AM CDT up 0 recs

They have played football before?

Or are these people who have been brought in off the street? Most of the season they have looked like the latter. Most of these guys have played football since they were knee high to a grasshopper, gap control, blocking, getting off blocks do not change that much.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:36 AM CDT up 0 recs

One rookie on the field can be covered by Vets

Putting four or five out there on the same side of the ball along with all the other 2nd and 3rd year players we have is a lot different.

There is an enormous difference between college and the NFL and if you don’t see that it explains a lot

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:45 AM CDT up 0 recs

Explains what MR. professional?

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:51 AM CDT up 0 recs

You act as though

our rookies are playing at the same level as 10 year vets.

You said:

Most of these guys have played football since they were knee high to a grasshopper, gap control, blocking, getting off blocks do not change that much

Do you really think Glen Dorsey is not going to get any better than he is now? Of course not. You know he will improve. Almost all of these guys will improve with more development. Look at the difference between Pollard last year and this year.

Yes most of these guys have played for most of their lives. But they have never played professionally against other professionals. The basics of the game are the same, the level of competition and technique are worlds apart.

So to lay all the blame on the coach being a bad coach when half the guys playing are still learning the NFL game is ignoring the reality of the situation.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:56 AM CDT up 0 recs

If he is so good

Why does this year look so much like last year? He has a new o-coordinator who is known for getting the best out of the players abilities. Yet we still look the same. He keeps the same tired veterans on the right side, why not try to evolve with the game as it evolves?

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 11:01 AM CDT up 0 recs

Jesus

We have 18 rookies on the roster this year and its the first year of a new offense with a new offensive coordinator that is still figuring out what the players can do.

There are obviously still holes on the roster that couldn’t be filled in a single offseason.

Lets use the opposite logic. If Herm is so horrible, how did he have any winning seasons? Why hasn’t every season he’s been a coach been this bad? How did he ever take 4 teams to the playoffs?

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 11:06 AM CDT up 0 recs

Luck has alot

to do with it. You yourself have said that, not about Herm, but other coaches being successful. Have you noticed when he changes the systems to his way things crumble? He always has alot of injuries, that has came here with him. Why that what is this dumbfounded look on the sidelines rather than do something about it?

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 11:10 AM CDT up 0 recs

The detractors always come up with excuses

As much as you say I make excuses for Herm, you make excuses for the part of his record thats good.

Everything you say about Herm is highly subjective and not realy based on any facts, but just your impressions.

The facts are when Herm has had a decent team, they have had a decent record. When Herm has had a mix mash like in his third season with New York and his last two seasons here, they’ve been bad.

Wow thats a novel idea isn’t it? That how any coaches team does relies more on the quality of the players than who is coaching them? WOW!

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 12:48 PM CDT up 0 recs

He has got younger

Like HE wants, Herm is not a good coach period. He is a walking sound bite. WOW! Look at the way these players play once they are down two scores it is over. That IS all on the coach, it is his job to get them up to play. Just like last year he cannot do it. Hang on while I call a timeout , before I challenge this questionable play!

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 2:36 PM CDT up 0 recs

Also he hand picked these players.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 2:53 PM CDT up 0 recs

When they get down by 2 scores

of course everything goes down the drain. We have to go away from the major gameplan which is running, why, because thats our biggest strength, so we have to start passing which we don’t have a QB who can throw the damn ball. Ill give it to you that play calling has been shit but you cant be a good coach if you dont have good players. Our guys will be good, we have seen glimpses of that but they aren’t just yet.

by ComeSackMyQB on Oct 11, 2008 3:51 PM CDT up 0 recs

I love PFT

Mike Florio knows a lot of insiders in the industry and doesn’t post anything unless its confirmed from his sources.

But he gets way too many stories wrong to take him at his word 100%. Like Terry Bradshaw dying.,,,unfortunately that stuff ruins your credibility.

by primetime 07 on Oct 11, 2008 9:20 AM CDT up 0 recs

And

His source for the TG story was a reader who saw the story on channel 13 in Kansas City.

by primetime 07 on Oct 11, 2008 9:22 AM CDT up 0 recs

I read somewhere a week ago

that the word is that the Chiefs would only CONSIDER trading him if they were offered a first round pick… but that’s probably just a rumor.

by Vince D on Oct 11, 2008 7:21 AM CDT 0 recs

I'm a big TG fan,

but it’s time he puts on his big boy pants and do his job.

He’s made a boat load of money from this organization and been treated very well. He doesn’t “deserve” a shot at a ring for his time here. He’s owed nothing. He is a player. A piece of a larger organization and he has had a wonderful opportunity to play football professionally.

If we get a good trade, I have no problem with it. I’m actually begining to hope for it if all this inuendo is true.

He knew about rebuilding before the season started. I’m not sorry we preserved a win rather than give him another catch at home.

He’s more than welcome to retire if his feelings got hurt so bad.

by NJChiefsFan on Oct 11, 2008 8:37 AM CDT 0 recs

Maybe his feelings

Are not hurt, maybe he has no faith in the coaching here.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:06 AM CDT up 0 recs

Same coaching

that he’s had for the two previous years except for Chan Gailey. Do you honestly think that he’s all the sudden decided that Herm is the worst coach in the NFL like you do?

IF Tony is suddenly deciding he wants to leave (and I still say thats a big if), its more likely that the reality of the situation is hitting him. That rebuilding takes more than one offseason and that it takes players longer than five games to develop.

I think its more likely that Tony has told them that he doesn’t necessarily want to leave, but that he would be OK with it if he got to go to a contending team and the Chiefs got the compensation they wanted. Since the Chiefs are likely pushing for 1st round compensation and aren’t likely to get it, I don’t see Tony going anywhere.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:27 AM CDT up 0 recs

Reminds me of the rumors of the LJ trade last year

The Chiefs had no intention of trading LJ unless they got an offer they couldn’t refuse, but were listening all the same. I think its probably the same situation here. I’m sure they’re fielding calls, but unless they get offered something they simply can’t pass up, its not going to happen.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:29 AM CDT up 0 recs

Just calling it like I see it.

I have no faith in Herm, maybe players are starting to feel the same way. Herb Taylor for instance, the team is supposed to be going young. Instead he is stuck behind a vet, whom Herb has clearly out performed. Hern has said it himself that Herb can play both sides, why is it so hard to see that Mac sucks?

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:32 AM CDT up 0 recs

Herb Taylor

Is not a future starter. He is a decent pass blocker and a poor run blocker. They like him as a backup LT and thats where they want him in the future and what they are working with him on, so it would actually stunt his development as a backup LT to play him at RT (its a lot harder to switch sides than people think, anyone remember Jordan Black?).

I know its hard to believe now, but the Chiefs RT is not always going to be as bad as they have been the last two years. They will (eventually) find a guy that is competent to play that position, and in the long run, they will be much better off having kept Herb practicing at LT instead of swapping him back and forth.

Herm is much more patient than the fans are. He knows what he wants out of this team in the future and he won’t mess that up unless he absolutely has to.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:52 AM CDT up 0 recs

So if Albert gets hurt again

are you saying Herb, who has started for him, won’t start for him again?

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Oct 11, 2008 3:25 PM CDT up 0 recs

That I will disagree with you on

Herb has shown that he is better than Sackintosh so why wouldn’t they give him a shot no matter if they think he is just a backup. We obviously have line problems and if he has shown he is the answer to at least one of those problems he deserves to play.

by ComeSackMyQB on Oct 11, 2008 3:55 PM CDT up 0 recs

Are you making my point?

Are you making my point?…lol, Good point!

"But what do I know, I’m like an empty room with a large ECHO"

by Lanier63 on Oct 11, 2008 4:47 PM CDT up 0 recs

That I was

I was siding with you there

by ComeSackMyQB on Oct 12, 2008 1:40 AM CDT up 0 recs

That is a poor

Comparison Jordan Black, Herb Taylor. Herm himself, your god best coach ever has said it himself Herb is the swing tackle, that is his saving grace. He played EVERY position on the o-line in college, that shows versatility.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:56 AM CDT 0 recs

Don't start exaggerating

I only stick up for Herm because you are scapegoating him. You are very unrealistic in your expectations because you have disliked the guy from the beginning.

Yes, Herb CAN play every position in college and they would use him to do that in an emergency situation (if McIntosh went down with an injury in a game you would see Herb there). If Richardson were further along in his development, you would probably see Herb come in in the middle of a game to fill the position (Richardson is usually inactive and you don’t usually keep a bunch of O-linemen active) but then have Richardson take over the position the next game (again, if Richardson were further along developmentally).

How is comparing Jordan Black a bad example? They swung him back and forth between sides and it stunted his development. Now he’s not even playing.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 11:03 AM CDT up 0 recs

Jordan is doing alot for the Texans isn't he.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 10:58 AM CDT 0 recs

That was kind of the point.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 11:03 AM CDT up 0 recs

I thought Dickie V

Brought in horrible players from the draft? Now all of a sudden they stunted his growth? Could be he was not a good player.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 11:12 AM CDT 0 recs

That could be

But we’ll never know because they flopped him around all over the place.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 12:49 PM CDT up 0 recs

You make more excuses

Than a politician. I know it is Dick’s fault we are in this situation. None of this falls in Herm’s lap.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 2:37 PM CDT up 0 recs

Glad to hear you admit it

Jordan Black was flip flopped all over the line so he could never get his technique down. Who knows if he could ever have been a good player or not. The point is he wasn’t given much of a chance because all Vermeil cared about was his window, not about what was left when he was gone.

Most reasonable people were willing to admit that Croyle didn’t have a chance to prove himself last year because of all the holes on this team. Why does Herm not get the same reason?

Yes, Herm brought the players to the team. He is bringing young players because it is a long term strategy to stop the cycle of being a mediocre team every year and losing the first game of the playoffs and to build a team capable of winning a championship. If it were so easy to do that you could do it in one year, every team in the NFL would do it.

We have young players that have raw talent. It is going to take time for that talent to emerge. We also still have gaping holes in the roster. Young, inexperienced players + gaping holes is not a recipe for success, I don’t care who your coach is.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 4:35 PM CDT up 0 recs

Like I was serious.

The rebuild started last year, we are not getting better we are going backwards. I do not care how young the talent is on the field we should not be this bad. Again Miami, Atlanta made changes, and in less than a year they are better teams than last year. Could this team be better, yes but Herm is so stubborn he will not change or adapt. The Taylor Sacintosh thing just proves my point. Pretty soon that the young players are going to take on the losing mindset, and this team will never get better.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 5:41 PM CDT up 0 recs

I know you weren't serious

Just digging at you a little. :)

The thing is, you call Herm stubborn because he hasn’t changed anything YET. We’re only five games into the season. You cannot make any guarantee that Herb Taylor won’t have the same problem transitioning to the other side McIntosh is. Yeah, Herbs doing an OK job on the left side, but McIntosh was ok on the left side last year too.

Just because you think its a good idea does not mean it will automatically be succesful. Thats something some people need to learn. Just because you think something is a good idea doesn’t mean it really is.

Regardless, Herm is patient, not stubborn. He can move Herb to the right side any time he wants to IF he wants to. He is giving McIntosh time to make the transition and if they move Herb over there, he might need time to make the transition too.

by ChiefDJ on Oct 11, 2008 10:48 PM CDT up 0 recs

So you think giving Herm

More time is a good idea, that means it is going to be successful? Just wondering if you feel the same about your own thoughts? Just because Herm lays out a plan does not mean it is going to work.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 11:30 PM CDT up 0 recs

I think his point is

That Herm’s plan will take longer than what you want.

by primetime 07 on Oct 11, 2008 11:36 PM CDT up 0 recs

I think if it takes

Longer than the end of this season for this team to start turning the corner, and showing some promise he goes sooner rather than later.

by Eric Allen on Oct 11, 2008 11:44 PM CDT up 0 recs

That

would be one of the quickest rebuilds in history.

by primetime 07 on Oct 12, 2008 11:01 AM CDT up 0 recs

I am not saying playoffs

I am saying consistent. Showing that these players are catching on. Clark himself expected to see a competitive team this year, is he going to go back on that now? Miami, Atlanta appear to have turned it around, and are competitive in LESS than a year. Why can’t Herm be expected to at least field a competitive team?

by Eric Allen on Oct 12, 2008 11:12 AM CDT up 0 recs

Consistency

You just cant expect consistency from young guys. If we did then this would be a much better team with the “potential” we have.

I’m not defending any position just playing a little devil’s advocate :)

by primetime 07 on Oct 12, 2008 11:18 AM CDT up 0 recs

The owner himself

Expects the team to be competitive, why can’t we as fans expect the same thing?

by Eric Allen on Oct 12, 2008 11:26 AM CDT up 0 recs

I think if our line was

Albert-Waters-Niswanger-Richardson-Taylor, we could actually keep our “franchise QB” healthy. I don’t think Brodie is the guy but they obviously do and they should think about ways to keep him healthy which they are not going to do with the pasture they have on the right side.

by ComeSackMyQB on Oct 11, 2008 4:00 PM CDT 0 recs